Playing all 6 hands???

Before others roll their eyes at the title. (i would too......probably)

Let me preface my question with the scenario set up.

6D, LS, RSA, 80%pen, no heat. (most of the pitbosses are like bag boys/girls)

Now when this casino gets busy (which it is MOST of the time) it's sometimes hard to even get a seat. Most of the time, I am relagated to me and my freind are just going 50/50 each and spreading on our 2 hands. Yet there are still 6 seats being dealt too however (not ideal, but thats the best I can do w/ 6 seats).

Ideally, i like to play 1 hand, and when i get TC 2 or more, then spread it out to 2 hands. (and even tho the other players is not a variable i control, well i obviously ideally want there to be NO other players) yet that's rarely the case.

The max hands allowed to be played is 3.
- If one get's to an open table, and 2 people sit down, they can play 3 each, therefore covering the whole table.
I have a freind (learning, just starting) I can bring with me and have play 3 hands and I play the other 3. (basically I will be playing all 6, he just does the motions for 3 of them, but its really all me)

The reason I bring this up and ask for your feedback is due to the set up that i am given (ultra busy casino). And also even tho not mathmatically ideal, I "think" this beats out playing 1 or maybe 2 with 6 total. Like i said the heat is not an issue, I can spread 10 x 6....to 500x6 without problem.

Please let me have your feedback/suggestions, input, or opinions for those who have done anything similar or have some insight

thanks in advance

if you can play 6 spots and spread 50 units the PC's sure are asleep at the wheel.

where is this mythical palace?

korea

More hands. Less Variance. Bigger Bankroll.

reminds me of the bellagio. Russian Eastern European dude wants to play the all spots. Casino says no. russian dude turns to his (i carry his money man) and says then he play with me. So each plays 3 spots.

6D shoe game. Bad shoe. Keeps losing. Money man keeps pulling out stacks of 10k. He is losing like a Toyota Camry each shoe

I realize this is different than whales at Bacc and betting 10 - 20k+ a hand.

I think its a bad idea.

If you have been banned from WH, do you really want to be banned from another place? By planning all the spots, my guess is this is not standard and if it is not standard, then you would stand out. And if you stand out, your play is possibly subjected to more scrutiny.

Are you trying to make money? From my own experience, you actually make more money NOT playing as many hands. You make money playing positive counts. So some AP's will wong in and get 10-20 hands an hour rather than do a play all strategy that you are proposing...

but this is just my opinion.

From my experience, I get much better profit from playing 2 hands in Pos counts, and 1 hand in neg counts

Playing 1/2 kelly, this is not a violation. In that I am not betting more each hand. I am just playing more hands. I use the 150% approach.

ie if my max was 500 per hand, which i would use at at TC 6, instead I will play 325 x 2 hands (ie 750 total). Spreading out to 2 decreases the variance. And it's always deflating when the count is super high, and the 4 ploppies next to you do a bunch of un-called for splits and hits, and end up burning up all the cards and the shoe is done with, and there goes the hot count too.

one of the variables that we face as any AP is we want to be dealt fast, and have as many rounds as possible in a short time.

Korea deals slow.

They also shuffle, even after using that ASM. It's a slow paced game. And MOST of the time I am playing w/ 3-5 other players at the table.

I would not be betting 6 hands in the casino's eyes, that would be insane. I would be betting 3. The other person , (team) would be betting the other 3, and playing perfect BS (without idexes) and be there for the main purpose to keep the cards churning in the neg counts. and keep a ploppy away.

3 hands is a bit of an eye opener, I admit.
what if it was 3 players, playing 2 hands each, now that's very common. 2 other players that need no instruction, but they are extensions of my BK.
- im still just brainstorming here, on how to get optimal coverage at a packed casino, besides wonging.

again, im just brainstorming here, if anyone else has any experience in these situations and ideas or past stradegies, i would be glad to hear them all

thanks in advance

You would need to increase your spread to compensate for the additional hands played at negative counts. I thought that the table min max was 10 - 500.

I don't play in Korean casinos that much, but I would think that consistently going from 6 hands table min to 6 hands table max would draw attention.

And if you burn yourself from this place, would you also get banned from their sister properties? And then where would you play?

You're not going to play in Japan. I am assuming you don't look Japanese and speak Japanese natively. Macau is CSM. Singapore is CSM. Going to go to Vietnam?

In your situation, I would not kill the golden goose.

65D said:

Please let me have your feedback/suggestions

Click to expand...

Feedback:
Slow play can really kill your profits. If heat will not be an issue then I think it's a very good idea to cover as many spots as possible in order to keep the game going at the maximum pace possible.

Suggestions:
You may also want to teach your friend keep a side count of aces, or better yet; teach him the "perfect insurance side count". You might also want to have a signal telling him when to deviate from BS. In practice, this signal will not have to be given very often at all.

chichow said:

You would need to increase your spread to compensate for the additional hands played at negative counts. I thought that the table min max was 10 - 500.

I don't play in Korean casinos that much, but I would think that consistently going from 6 hands table min to 6 hands table max would draw attention.

And if you burn yourself from this place, would you also get banned from their sister properties? And then where would you play?

You're not going to play in Japan. I am assuming you don't look Japanese and speak Japanese natively. Macau is CSM. Singapore is CSM. Going to go to Vietnam?

In your situation, I would not kill the golden goose.

Click to expand...

Hold up, Japan? Last time I check there is no legal gambling establishments in Japan; not unless you want to mess with the Yazuka, which I don't think it's a good idea once you start winning.

Sucker,

The slow play at times does suck. My intent is to get as much table coverage +hands per hour with the least amount of heat.
Thanks for the tip, a perfect insurance count would be the best possible adjunt besides my count that I can think of. Thanks for mentioning it.
This place uses a simple hand shuffle profile, but they ALSO use that 2 tower asm in addition to it. So (according to my novice knowledge) it can't be shuffle tracked, leaving the perfect insurance stradegy the best adjunt, your right.

In regards to the Indexes, he actually already knows a set of compromised ones I made for FELT (basically its the Ben Franklin indexes 0,5,10). I went ahead and memorized the FELT-F b/c I play more. The signal for the 0,5,10 can be easy. If i bet min, its 0, if i bet 5 units its 5, if i bet 20 units its 10. So the index can be done from looking at my wager.

I wong out a good amount. (about half the shoes that go bad, I dont do all of them b/c I dont want to generate too much heat)
- i wish I had the skill already to wong in. I guess since the casino being extremly crowded is the part I am trying to overcome here.
How can one wong in sucessfully, when there are ZERO seats for him to even play at, and he must wait 45 mins just to get one?



chichow,

going from 10x6 to 500 x 6 in perfect unison would be TOO much of a heat inducer. You are correct. Maybe I am slow. But i have to first envision the most extreme scenario, to accomplish what I am trying to do, THEN...look at it, and try and make it actual reasonable and do-able. And see how much I have to cover it up, to make it still be there mostly, yet not visible.
- like:
me and 2 freinds: spread on seats 2, 5,6 (me at 6)
I can even have my freinds wong OUT when it gets to tc 2. (yes wong out), which leaves ME more cards to gobble up. OR i bet on his hand. Probably mix it up between the 2 so its not an obvious pattern either way.
Have my freind beside me always going to get 40 bucks out the ATM every time, like a compulsive loser. (ie this gives him more excuses to get up mid shoe, to go get more money, ie wonging out). Every 5-6 times, the classic cell phone ring, pick up..talk on phone. There are enough differant wonging out tactics to rotate through to where "on average" I would likely play 10x2 in neg counts. Which is good, as long as I can spread to max x 2 at the least. And the kicker is when it's good, get the plopplies OFF the table.
#2 would be able to do that. I would just run 5/6 slots.

Chichow, your right, i need to read up on wonging, and how its best to find the entry. But I just can't help but think in an overly packed casino, even if I can wong in for the last 1/3 of a shoe, it would probably be another 40 minutes till I can do that again. And with 6 people playing, that might very well be 4 total hands in 1.5hrs. Even though I would endure neg counts with playing all, the spread will be so large I just think it can be more profitable than wonging in this condition. But I cant say I am sure, as I have not wonged this place repeatedly as my core stradegy for play.

in regards to the heat. I might speak of what is the most profitable first. After that, THEN i will think of how to cover it up to make it no heat. I am not smart enough to do them both at the same time. I have to do it in that order.
the first picture is probably un-realistic, but it captures the intent

Universal wong question:

your in a busy casino, you wong a table and its so packed you have to bet on another guys hand. Then after 45 mins later, and only 4-5 hands you have played total, he leaves and the dealer says "here is your seat sir".
You just say nope, I like to watch all the tables???

Im sure some of you have been in a casino when it might be SO busy, that wonging is difficult.

Dave said:

Hold up, Japan? Last time I check there is no legal gambling establishments in Japan; not unless you want to mess with the Yazuka, which I don't think it's a good idea once you start winning.

Click to expand...

Well I mentioned Vietnam which isn't that far from going to Cambodia and other unsavory locals.

It is not legal in Japan, but you can play in many many places in Tokyo. Mentioning the Yazuka is no different than ties that organized crime used to and still has with gambling

Ask the APs.

How many spots do they want being played by others at a table, when they are playing...

And personally again, I would switch to playing at off hours rather than try and dominate a table.

YMMV