Anyone know the math for this....

[shadroch]

In a face up game,you see all the boards cards so you get to see how many 4s or 5s are out when deciding to hit a 16.
There are numerous other hands that being able to see the boards hands affect,insurance being a big one.
Having the cards face up gives other advantages,as well.You increase the chances of interacting with other players hands.As an example,you might get to buy an Ace off of someone reluctant to split against a face.
Yet,all the charts I see treat all DD games the same.
They rate them by H17 or S17,DAS or not,DOA or not,Surrender or not.
Shouldn't face up or down, and mid shoe entry or not be somehow factored in. There seems to be a fairly big difference between a DD shoe and a DD pitch game. Is it that the DD shoe game is still fairly new,and hasn't been studied enough yet?

 

[Automatic Monkey]

The benefit of a game being dealt face-up is real. It has the same effect as extra penetration; i.e., each playing decision you make is going to be made as if you had an extra full round of penetration, which at a full table is around a quarter of a deck. Don't confuse this with an extra quarter of a deck penetration, because it helps only with playing, not with betting.

The CBJN does indicate which DD games are dealt from a shoe. The only downside of a shoe is that it tends to makes the penetration more consistent across the casino, and this makes it harder to find a dealer who is giving better than average pen.

 

[p8ntballsk8r]

monkey maybe it's different where you go, but playing 6d i've found some dealers who cut off only have a deck, and some who cut 1 and 1/4 a deck