Can someone help me with the math for this.

[shadroch]

Double deck,S17.

What do you give up if you double down every non-breakable hand vs dealer 5 and 6.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Double deck,S17.

What do you give up if you double down every non-breakable hand vs dealer 5 and 6.

Around 0.3%.

 

[shadroch]

Around 0.3%.

That would be 0.3% on those hands only,correct? Not 0.3% overall.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

That would be 0.3% on those hands only,correct? Not 0.3% overall.

Same thing. You're only changing your strategy on those hands, it doesn't affect any other hands.

Oh and I'm assuming this applies only to non-split hands. You didn't mean it to apply to doubling on hands like 2,2 vs. 6 and 3,3 vs. 6 and A,A vs. 5, did you?

 

[shadroch]

no.

 

[SilentBob420BMFJ]

Same thing. You're only changing your strategy on those hands, it doesn't affect any other hands.

Oh and I'm assuming this applies only to non-split hands. You didn't mean it to apply to doubling on hands like 2,2 vs. 6 and 3,3 vs. 6 and A,A vs. 5, did you?

.3% overall? i dont think so, there is no way the house edge would go from lets say .45% to .75% just because you always double 4-11 vs 5,6.. that is something i would expect if you always hit your hard 17 or something

 

[Dog Hand]

First Post Here... Be Kind

shadrock,

I used CVData to sim a 2D, S17, DAS, 60% pen. game with two players flat-betting $100/hand.

Player 1 used Complete Basic Strategy, while Player 2 used a modified B.S. in which, in addition to the B.S. DD, versus a dealer's 5 or 6 Player 2 also DD on soft 19, soft 20, hard 8 (except 4,4), hard 7, hard 6 (except 3,3), and hard 5.

Player 1's IBA was -0.247%, his TBA was -0.219%, his Split advantage was 5.673%, his Soft DD advantage was 9.471%, and his Hard DD advantage was 19.608%.

Player 2's IBA was -0.474%, his TBA was -0.414%, his Split advantage was 5.080%, his Soft DD advantage was 12.334%, and his Hard DD advantage was 16.451%.

Since Initial Bet Advantage is the player's EV, we can see that your "crazy DD" strategy costs 0.227%.

To check this results, I used Excel to calculate the answer a different way. Using the tables in BJA3, I calculated the penalty for each "crazy DD" hand, multiplied each penalty by its frequency, then summed to get the total. This method shows that the "crazy DD" strategy costs 0.192%.

I suspect the discrepancy between the sim results and the book results is due to the cut-card effect.

Hope this helps!

Dog Hand

 

[Mimosine]

.3% overall? i dont think so, there is no way the house edge would go from lets say .45% to .75% just because you always double 4-11 vs 5,6.. that is something i would expect if you always hit your hard 17 or something

your expectation and reality seem at odds sometimes.

that is why AM is right and you are wrong on this one.

 

[k_c]

What I get

Double deck,S17.

What do you give up if you double down every non-breakable hand vs dealer 5 and 6.

2 decks, S17, split to 4 hands, DA2

EV: normal basic strategy, total dependent
NDAS: -.3349
DAS : -.1925

Double pre-split non-bustable hands v 5,6
NDAS: -.4884
DAS: -.3460

Double pre-split and post-split non-bustable hands v 5,6
NDAS: post-split not applicable
DAS: -.3587

k_c

 

[Kasi]

Same thing. You're only changing your strategy on those hands, it doesn't affect any other hands.

I have no idea what the answer is but, surely, it's unlikely that the disadvantage is the same on only those hands and also the same as to the overall decresae in HA. I think that's what Shadroch may have been asking.

Is that what you meant?

Anyway, I guess for the overall decrease in HA, all I'm saying is, wouldn't one have to take frequency into consideration?

I'm sure if Shadroch got a little more specific about the rules, like whether soft-doubling is allowed, or even hard 9, and the split stuff, etc., the smart guys here, no names lol, could probbaly give a pretty accurate answer, especially as to the overall HA effect.

Shadroch - you really have a DD S17 game with DA2? Cool!

Anywhere near Vegas? Going there soon lol.