Can you count against this shoe.
- Thread starter Mr. T
- Start date
jack.jackson
Well-Known Member
I've never understood what the casinos reasoning for doing this? Its the same thing as the cards behind the cut cards. I wonder if they think, theyre actually disabling card counters:laugh:Mr. T said:
ihate17
Well-Known Member
Hand shuffled or ASM?
If it is a hand shuffled game, this procedure is costing that casino a lot of money over time by forcing the dealer to shuffle perhaps as much as 20% more often in a heads up game. If they are using an ASM, cost is insignificant in comparision.
You did not mention how deep they also cut the shoe. If they for instance only cut 1 deck, then with three players at the table, the initial 10 cards plus the additional burn cards between hands might equal another half deck. In a one on one game it would equal another deck or so. So they have reduced pen for less players and increased it when there are more players.
If they cut 1.5 decks or more, then pen is so bad that you should avoid the game unless there are other factors.
1 deck cut, 208 cards in play, less 10 card burn, is 198 cards. At 5.5 cards per round heads up plus 1 burn card you get about 30 rounds, so about 1 3/4 decks never play. Any more than that you are looking a two or more decks either cut or burned.
Why they do this: Perhaps a form of paranoia, a common disease that effects many casinos.
ihate17
If it is a hand shuffled game, this procedure is costing that casino a lot of money over time by forcing the dealer to shuffle perhaps as much as 20% more often in a heads up game. If they are using an ASM, cost is insignificant in comparision.
You did not mention how deep they also cut the shoe. If they for instance only cut 1 deck, then with three players at the table, the initial 10 cards plus the additional burn cards between hands might equal another half deck. In a one on one game it would equal another deck or so. So they have reduced pen for less players and increased it when there are more players.
If they cut 1.5 decks or more, then pen is so bad that you should avoid the game unless there are other factors.
1 deck cut, 208 cards in play, less 10 card burn, is 198 cards. At 5.5 cards per round heads up plus 1 burn card you get about 30 rounds, so about 1 3/4 decks never play. Any more than that you are looking a two or more decks either cut or burned.
Why they do this: Perhaps a form of paranoia, a common disease that effects many casinos.
ihate17
jack.jackson
Well-Known Member
Ya that makes a difference!
Oh ****! I missed the part where they burn a card after every round as well as the ten, on the shuffle.Now I understand, what the hell the rhino was talkin about!
Oh ****! I missed the part where they burn a card after every round as well as the ten, on the shuffle.Now I understand, what the hell the rhino was talkin about!
EmeraldCityBJ
Well-Known Member
Calculating true count
In addition to worsening penetration, the burn cards make it a little more tricky to convert from a running count to a true count since there are several unseen cards in the discard rack.
The marginally increased difficulty of doing a true count calculation probably wouldn't be enough to deter a good card counter. It wouldn't take much effort to make this adjustment. However, the worsened penetration might turn a playable game into an unplayable game.
In addition to worsening penetration, the burn cards make it a little more tricky to convert from a running count to a true count since there are several unseen cards in the discard rack.
The marginally increased difficulty of doing a true count calculation probably wouldn't be enough to deter a good card counter. It wouldn't take much effort to make this adjustment. However, the worsened penetration might turn a playable game into an unplayable game.