Casino Verite Software

BFC

Active Member
Is this program recommended by anybody, or not recommended by anybody? I've tried the demo and was about to order, but their website seems kinda hokey and amateurish - is it reliable/safe?
Are there better programs for a similar price? It seems a bit $$$ but maybe I'm underestimating.
 

moo321

Well-Known Member
Arnold Snyder has free software on his site. Personally, I don't think it's worth the price.
 

Xenophon

Well-Known Member
Casino Verite software has value, but after having used it, and some other software, I would probably go this route.

Buy Blackbelt in Blackjack, Blackjack Attack 3rd ed., and BJRM, which is software that helps you analyze risk of ruin and shows you what kind of profit and fluctuations you can expect, among other things.

Buy a few dozen decks of used casino cards, and practice live instead of with software. Count, deck estimation, etc.

I've spent roughly $500-600 on books, software, and training supplies analyzing the game, and in my opinion, you can spend about 150 bucks on the items listed above and after careful study, have a solid understanding of all published information, by buying only a fraction of the published information.
 

zengrifter

Banned
I am going to review the CV. Despite recent claims to the contrary, I have never recommnded it, BUT the single most important software application for a card-counter is the training drills, and I'll be looking hard at CV drills, among other things.

On general principal the QFIT CV is the best software on the market for various apps, but I'll let everyone know what I think about the drills. zg
 

ScottH

Well-Known Member
zengrifter said:
I am going to review the CV. Despite recent claims to the contrary, I have never recommnded it, BUT the single most important software application for a card-counter is the training drills, and I'll be looking hard at CV drills, among other things.

On general principal the QFIT CV is the best software on the market for various apps, but I'll let everyone know what I think about the drills. zg
The deck estimation drills are useful. You can either do drills for estimating remaining decks, or true count conversion drills.
 

BFC

Active Member
thanks, i checked it out, unfortunately its windows only, but i've found a couple mac programs.

of course i use windows at work, meaning..... i will end up wasting a lot of my company's time if i download the windows versions
 

Kaiser

Well-Known Member
I think I'll make some popcorn, sit back, and enjoy the battle that will surely come.

*paging craps master*

:)
 

Sonny

Well-Known Member
I would recommend CV over live play with actual cards, especially in the beginning. CV is very fast. One hour of practice with CV can easily equal 3-4 hours of practice with real cards and chips. The software takes care of all the dealing, shuffling, payouts, and other things that take up most of the time. It also corrects all of your mistakes, which won’t happen if you are playing by yourself.

I’ve used the drills and I really liked them. The “deck countdown” will really help you get the speed you need, and the BS drill and index drills are helpful for beginners too. Nothing will prepare you for live play in a casino (except live play in a casino) but CV will get your game sharp enough that you can worry about other things when you get to the casino.

-Sonny-
 
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moo321

Well-Known Member
I guess I just don't think software is a good way to practice live play. Although, I learned basic strategy whoring bonuses, so that portion is fine to practice on software. But I remember the first time I tried to count in a casino, after thinking I was fine because I practiced with software: It didn't go well.
 

GeorgeD

Well-Known Member
IMHO CV is great for learning and perfecting basic strategy. Playing the game in CV is OK, but drills are especially good once you know your weak spots. I liked that you can set the flashcard drills to test you only on the types of hands you are weak on - Ie soft hit/stand, soft DD etc.

As someone said it's faster than manual drills. Manual you have to deal cards, decide your move and then check a BS card to see if your right EVEN IF YOU ARE POSITIVE, because otherwise you might teach yourself wrong. CV tells if you are right/wrong and what's correct.

I finally got even my bad plays with A/7 straight using CV.

The game is good too, but once you have most of BS down you waste a lot of time playing Ez hands.

Not so sure it's as helpful learning counting, but the game is pretty good to test your counting/betting strategy together.

I agree, though it's hardly like real casino play.
 

zengrifter

Banned
moo321 said:
I guess I just don't think software is a good way to practice live play. Although, I learned basic strategy whoring bonuses, so that portion is fine to practice on software. But I remember the first time I tried to count in a casino, after thinking I was fine because I practiced with software: It didn't go well.
Hard drilling on software is the best way to get most of the counting elements down solid - superior to cardd or casino play. zg
 
moo321 said:
Arnold Snyder has free software on his site. Personally, I don't think it's worth the price.
I agree, the free software on Arnold's site is not worth the price!

CVData is worth the price for anyone who:

Travels to games and wishes to simulate them to learn and compare their values ahead of time.

Develops their own counts, indices or spreads.

Wishes to analyze sidebets and methods of beating them.

Researches blackjack derivative games.

Being I do all of these things, I find it to be worth the price. Of course, people were doing all of these things without CVData, and I could probably write something to meet my needs in a few hundred hours of software authorship time, but I'd rather buy an existing product and spend those few hundred hours at the table getting paid. Or watching TV and eating ice cream.
 
zengrifter said:
Hard drilling on software is the best way to get most of the counting elements down solid - superior to cardd or casino play. zg
You know, I think that varies a lot by the individual. I can't practice with software much at all. The only place I can really get into it is at a casino table with real money. Good thing I learn quick, it would be very expensive otherwise!

Some people do need to practice a lot at home before they can bring themselves to do it in a casino.
 

halcyon1234

Well-Known Member
I don't have CV, but from everything I've seen and read about it, it is exactly what I would program if I were to roll my own. It's pretty much a way to try out anything you ever wanted to do in Blackjack, and it's perfect in its analysis of what you should be doing (something, I'd bet, NO human AP could do for you-- at least not for $200, in the comfort of your own home, forever, in your underwear)

The price is steep, but if you're serious about counting, the price is entirely justifyable. Think about it this way:

If you're going to be professionally counting, you'll be laying down $500, maybe even $1500 bets. If you are giving up even .2% of advantage to something CV would correct-- it's conceivable that you'll be giving up at least $200 in EV over a single weekend. Why not give it to QFIT once, instead of a casino over and over and over? =)

If counting is your main hobby, well, it's like the cost of any hobby. You can spend $200 easily on a hobby-- new train tracks, an onboard motor, two boxes of Magic: The Gathering, an XBox, and so forth. And like some hobbies, this would be a purchase that would eventually pay for itself.

If you're a poor student computer student like me, you go "wow, CV is cool", then keep playing with your dollar store cards on the table. =)
 

BFC

Active Member
thanks everybody. i'm thoroughly confused now :eek:

i have a feeling that when i play in a casino the 1st time it will be overwhelming, but i'm prepared for that. My job is pretty fast paced and distracting so hopefully the coping skills i use there will help me in the casino.
 

GeorgeD

Well-Known Member
schnerg said:
thanks everybody. i'm thoroughly confused now :eek:

i have a feeling that when i play in a casino the 1st time it will be overwhelming, but i'm prepared for that. My job is pretty fast paced and distracting so hopefully the coping skills i use there will help me in the casino.
For me the hardest thing to get past in early casino (besides just plain nervousness) was the pace. I had played charity games, but they're slow. CV can help you get used the pace as far as getting and totaling your cards, deciding the play and making the play without hesitation.

CV's a help for that, but not quite like the real thing where you also have the distraction of ringing slots, chatting dealers/players, waitresses in short skirts bringing you drinks. A first trip may become overwhelming especially if you are also trying to count. You'll probably lose the count, but in the beginning that's not as important as playing good basic strategy. CV can help prepare you for the whole experience.
 
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