I'm curious what you all think about the morality of card counting at a casino night at a church, or another organization or event. When I was first learning to count cards, my friend and I went to a church casino night to practice, but I felt very guilty counting cards. I know that counting isn't cheating, but it somehow feels wrong. Thoughts anyone?
Church casino nights
- Thread starter DSCH
- Start date
Stealth Bomber
Well-Known Member
It's only wrong to sandbag your intelligence
God provided you with the gift of being able to count cards. It wouldn't be right NOT to use your ability. It's okay to be good but not okay to cheat.
If you beat the church so bad you feel uncomfortable, then you can certainly donate the prizes you won to charity or even back to the church.
God provided you with the gift of being able to count cards. It wouldn't be right NOT to use your ability. It's okay to be good but not okay to cheat.
If you beat the church so bad you feel uncomfortable, then you can certainly donate the prizes you won to charity or even back to the church.
Automatic Monkey
Banned
Mark 11:15-16
Being that I know the church is having the casino night with the expectation of winning for the purpose of supporting the church, I would not use a church casino to make money. If I went to practice counting, I'd anonymously donate my winnings back to the church, or lose it all before I leave. But that's just me, no disrespect for anyone who took a different approach.
For a church to use gambling with its implicit promises of profit for the purpose of getting money from its congregation and others is equally questionable to me. This is a false promise that casinos make to us and churches should not follow their lead. It could also cause or trigger an addiction in some people.
Christians snicker when they hear that you have to pay to belong to a synagogue, lots of jokes can be made about that, but that sounds like not such a bad idea on reflection. If everyone pays, everyone is equal in that respect, and they don't have to get involved in other things like gambling that could possibly degrade their message.
Being that I know the church is having the casino night with the expectation of winning for the purpose of supporting the church, I would not use a church casino to make money. If I went to practice counting, I'd anonymously donate my winnings back to the church, or lose it all before I leave. But that's just me, no disrespect for anyone who took a different approach.
For a church to use gambling with its implicit promises of profit for the purpose of getting money from its congregation and others is equally questionable to me. This is a false promise that casinos make to us and churches should not follow their lead. It could also cause or trigger an addiction in some people.
Christians snicker when they hear that you have to pay to belong to a synagogue, lots of jokes can be made about that, but that sounds like not such a bad idea on reflection. If everyone pays, everyone is equal in that respect, and they don't have to get involved in other things like gambling that could possibly degrade their message.
Felix Rue-de-Guerre
Well-Known Member
Charity Games *LINK*
These things are rarely beatable by counting anyway. Did you find a charity game where ties push? If so, you are fortunate. Also, spreads are usually severely throttled, like 2-10 bucks.
If you are worried about ethical considerations... don't. These things are often run for churches by "fund-raising" organizations that are more corrupt than any casino. See link to old post on this.
-Felix
These things are rarely beatable by counting anyway. Did you find a charity game where ties push? If so, you are fortunate. Also, spreads are usually severely throttled, like 2-10 bucks.
If you are worried about ethical considerations... don't. These things are often run for churches by "fund-raising" organizations that are more corrupt than any casino. See link to old post on this.
-Felix
last time i played in a charity/casino night...
the 21 game was single deck, dealt to the bottom, with no limits other than your buy-in. the "cash" earned was then redeemed in an auction for donated prizes. top prize was a tv, which i was fortunate to "win", simply 'cause i had accumulated the most script.
the 21 game was single deck, dealt to the bottom, with no limits other than your buy-in. the "cash" earned was then redeemed in an auction for donated prizes. top prize was a tv, which i was fortunate to "win", simply 'cause i had accumulated the most script.
learning to count
Well-Known Member
card counting vs morality
Gambling is considered evil and a sin by many religious sects. Card counting in its self is a intellectual skill as becoming a physicist. They both are harmless unless you want to make an a-bomb. If you have a problem with card counting then consider the real issue that you may have a gambling problem. All card counters are degenerate gamblers who win 1% over the house. So if the church leans over to sin take them and beat em at thier own game!
Gambling is considered evil and a sin by many religious sects. Card counting in its self is a intellectual skill as becoming a physicist. They both are harmless unless you want to make an a-bomb. If you have a problem with card counting then consider the real issue that you may have a gambling problem. All card counters are degenerate gamblers who win 1% over the house. So if the church leans over to sin take them and beat em at thier own game!
Rob McGarvey
Well-Known Member
Two Problems
with card counting or so I am told by certian knowledgable individuals. One is simply that if you are not successful at it, you are losing money that you could be doing good with, like feeding your family or someone elses. Two is the fact that if you are successful, you may not depend on the right person for your blessings and not give thanks for same. Further, if you play in a real casino, you are surrounded by a lot of neg posibilities, and even if you play online only, it does take time away from your family, yourself, and the better things in life you could be doing with your time.
I consider it as a second job where I can decide what hours to play, all based on the size of the advantage available. I have also set up time on certain days of the week were I go visit my Mom n Dad as they are in their golden years. I see them once every two weeks now. Our time is short, so we must make the best of it. EVERYTHING is advantage play, or not.
with card counting or so I am told by certian knowledgable individuals. One is simply that if you are not successful at it, you are losing money that you could be doing good with, like feeding your family or someone elses. Two is the fact that if you are successful, you may not depend on the right person for your blessings and not give thanks for same. Further, if you play in a real casino, you are surrounded by a lot of neg posibilities, and even if you play online only, it does take time away from your family, yourself, and the better things in life you could be doing with your time.
I consider it as a second job where I can decide what hours to play, all based on the size of the advantage available. I have also set up time on certain days of the week were I go visit my Mom n Dad as they are in their golden years. I see them once every two weeks now. Our time is short, so we must make the best of it. EVERYTHING is advantage play, or not.
Charity Casino Nights
Guys, if you're playing for real $ in a charity night, y'all best keep one hand over your wallet and the other hand over your family jewels cuz you're gonna lose one or the other before the nights out. If it's being run by an "outside" party planner, watch carefully for marked cards, dealing seconds, palmed chips and all sorts of nasty stuff. Most casino nights should be for "play" money with donated prizes and not for real bucks. When I got out of gaming for the better part of a decade, I worked occasionally for a California party planner that did more than 500 parties a year. Evidently, big business before Tribal casinos got their act together. 99% were OK gigs...but some "private" parties had me wondering...owner of an escort service wanted to throw a party for her top clients, prizes were her girls...professional ballplayer wanted party for his teammates and used loaded dice...bachelor party (usual strippers/hookers)but redeemed chips for REAL $. Real strange one was the well known parochial High School that wanted 21 dealers that knew how to deal seconds and/or "roll" the deck for "special" games during their annual three day fund raiser. Counting? Hole Carding? Marking or Daubing? Who cares? When you look around and can't spot the sucker, it just might be you....
Guys, if you're playing for real $ in a charity night, y'all best keep one hand over your wallet and the other hand over your family jewels cuz you're gonna lose one or the other before the nights out. If it's being run by an "outside" party planner, watch carefully for marked cards, dealing seconds, palmed chips and all sorts of nasty stuff. Most casino nights should be for "play" money with donated prizes and not for real bucks. When I got out of gaming for the better part of a decade, I worked occasionally for a California party planner that did more than 500 parties a year. Evidently, big business before Tribal casinos got their act together. 99% were OK gigs...but some "private" parties had me wondering...owner of an escort service wanted to throw a party for her top clients, prizes were her girls...professional ballplayer wanted party for his teammates and used loaded dice...bachelor party (usual strippers/hookers)but redeemed chips for REAL $. Real strange one was the well known parochial High School that wanted 21 dealers that knew how to deal seconds and/or "roll" the deck for "special" games during their annual three day fund raiser. Counting? Hole Carding? Marking or Daubing? Who cares? When you look around and can't spot the sucker, it just might be you....
Rob McGarvey
Well-Known Member
No Doubt
Very early on when I began playing I wanted to play single deck so bad that I started to look for these games for stags etc. I even had an in with the party planner who would tell me where the spot was. There were some tough spots I had to work my way out of so I decided to drop it, but it was easy cheesy for a while there. Nothing for charity unfortunately. I can think of more than one church that makes the Belagio look like a flop house. I can make that money do much better things than they can buying golden goodies and crystal chandeliers.
Very early on when I began playing I wanted to play single deck so bad that I started to look for these games for stags etc. I even had an in with the party planner who would tell me where the spot was. There were some tough spots I had to work my way out of so I decided to drop it, but it was easy cheesy for a while there. Nothing for charity unfortunately. I can think of more than one church that makes the Belagio look like a flop house. I can make that money do much better things than they can buying golden goodies and crystal chandeliers.