Dealer Mentions Counting

[MartyAce]

It comes up all the time, and I know there has been a thread on personal situations coming up so I thought I would add mine.

I've been on a real negative run lately where it seems I can't do anything right. So I sit down with my brother at a table and play with this dealer who isnt to vocal, however he has been joking with us about the bad streak we both seem to be on with him making huge hands.

So he knocks me out I buy in for $300 ($25 chips), and start playing a new shoe with him being the only one at the table with my brother. The count soon goes to a good positive where I'm betting 2-3 units and its going well. Then it just contiunes to go up and all of a sudden I have 6-8 units out there on several bets (only playing a single hand). And I'm winning, and the shoe ends with me probably having around $900 in front of me, a pretty good shoe.

So I stay for the next shoe and a similar positive count happens, but nothing too exciting and it ends when the dealer is on the last hand and says something about "whats the count?" and I mentioned that I have a 20 (my 2 tens in front of me). He doesn't say anything more and then when he goes to empty the remaining cards in the shoe says, "I ended the shoe with a -3 count, what about you?" And this caught me by surprise and I was just quiet. The dealer never brought anything up again, but these situations sometimes put me in a situation where I'm never sure the best answer.

Side note, I took insurance on my hand when the count called for it, and as he was going to check for the blackjack, he literally picked up his down card and top card and flashed me the bottom card. In this case he didnt have it, and I was left with having to hit a 17 versus his soft 19.

Overall he was a good dealer. Comments?

EDIT: I'm not worried about the dealer mentioning the counting so much, because it is not their job to identify and rat out counters (unless he has aspirations to move up in the casino world). And this one in particular I don't think would rat me out.

 

[Doofus]

EDIT: I'm not worried about the dealer mentioning the counting so much, because it is not their job to identify and rat out counters (unless he has aspirations to move up in the casino world). And this one in particular I don't think would rat me out.

He could be an advantage player himself. He could also be the kind of dealer who has half a brain, and is positive and friendly toward his players, in hope of being toked. Or both.

On the other hand, he could have been testing you to see if you were indeed counting cards. But as you say, what is the upside to him in ratting you out?

I would continue to play at his table, and see how this goes for you. What's the worst that could happen, getting backed off? BFD.

 

[ChefJJ]

Sounds like he was just f'ing with you...to shoot the bull and pass the time I'd imagine.

My 2 cents: Don't fall for the bait in case he is a rat, but just laugh it off to not be a total dick. :laugh:

good luck

 

[SecurityRisk]

Just out of curiosity, did the shoe end with a -3 count?

 

[MartyAce]

Just out of curiosity, did the shoe end with a -3 count?

No, it was actually +4. So it does sound like he was just messing around.

 

[mjbballar23]

It comes up all the time, and I know there has been a thread on personal situations coming up so I thought I would add mine.

I've been on a real negative run lately where it seems I can't do anything right. So I sit down with my brother at a table and play with this dealer who isnt to vocal, however he has been joking with us about the bad streak we both seem to be on with him making huge hands.

So he knocks me out I buy in for $300 ($25 chips), and start playing a new shoe with him being the only one at the table with my brother. The count soon goes to a good positive where I'm betting 2-3 units and its going well. Then it just contiunes to go up and all of a sudden I have 6-8 units out there on several bets (only playing a single hand). And I'm winning, and the shoe ends with me probably having around $900 in front of me, a pretty good shoe.

So I stay for the next shoe and a similar positive count happens, but nothing too exciting and it ends when the dealer is on the last hand and says something about "whats the count?" and I mentioned that I have a 20 (my 2 tens in front of me). He doesn't say anything more and then when he goes to empty the remaining cards in the shoe says, "I ended the shoe with a -3 count, what about you?" And this caught me by surprise and I was just quiet. The dealer never brought anything up again, but these situations sometimes put me in a situation where I'm never sure the best answer.

Side note, I took insurance on my hand when the count called for it, and as he was going to check for the blackjack, he literally picked up his down card and top card and flashed me the bottom card. In this case he didnt have it, and I was left with having to hit a 17 versus his soft 19.

Overall he was a good dealer. Comments?

EDIT: I'm not worried about the dealer mentioning the counting so much, because it is not their job to identify and rat out counters (unless he has aspirations to move up in the casino world). And this one in particular I don't think would rat me out.

If your worried about them telling on you, throw them a tip and that should get the job done. Most dealers wont rat out a friendly counter either way. The dealers im afraid of are the ones that dont actually know anything about how counting works and they just assume your going to win all the casinos money and their gonna loose their job and that counters are terrible devils. If a dealer asks you, dont openly admit it but dont sit their silently at 3rd base.

 

[Master@21]

I have to guess this was in Vegas? I had a friend of mine who was a great counter and also got a job as a dealer. He and I spoke many times and I played at his tables and I tested him on his ability to deal, tell the player his hand total, count money and still keep the count, and although he did pretty good most of the time, but he admitted it is a hard thing to do continuosly.

I have had that situation and what I say is, I'm not to good with math, but if you know when I should make a bigger bet, let me know and I will make a bet for you too!

This will usually flush them out and you can watch them for any signs of trying to do their job and keep a running count! Tips (or tokes) are a good way to get a dealer on your side. I have tipped dealers and in some cases, when I have been asked by the dealer if I wanted to split or double, I would ask, it all depends on your downcard, and they would actually look and tell me to do the right thing!

M@21

 

[mjbballar23]

re

I have tipped dealers and in some cases, when I have been asked by the dealer if I wanted to split or double, I would ask, it all depends on your downcard, and they would actually look and tell me to do the right thing!

M@21

and theres nothing illegal about that.

 

[rogue1]

Tokes and silence

I've decided to usually toke just as the dealer gets tapped out and I say thanks alot-now both dealers know I toke-and guess what? I almost never hear "CHECKS PLAY"
hmmm.

 

[NDN21]

I believe you did the right thing. You just mentioned your 20. You might add "20 vs whatever his upcard is". Let him think that is what you think he means when he mentions the count.

And about the dealer showing you if he had a blackjack, I would be leery. Don't get caught. If they know that you know that the dealer is showing you the downcard on purpose that could be illegal. Remember they don't have to prove much, just that you and dealer were cooperating to cheat the house.

 

[InPlay]

I just say what count are you useing. Then I get into a discussion on how card counting won't work. Thats usally good for a few chuckles espically if you are tanking.

 

[ihate17]

Be afraid

You might not have to be afraid of the dealer mentioning counting and if they know you play blackjack more than on a rare occassion, they might take it for granted that at least you have heard of counting. So, I ask them how it works, does it work, and questions like how does the casino feel about this. I am curious.

But be very afraid of the dealer who decides he likes you so much that he is willing to not only take a chance on going to jail to help you win but might just take you with him. Playing with the help is a crime. No dealer should be willing to do this unless he has already had a criminal agreement with the player. Doing for tokes or doing it because you are a nice guy, makes no sense at all.

As someone who looks for weak dealers, I am always thinking that someday I will find a dealer who flashes his hole card in a casino that decides we are working to together. So far, it has not happened.

ihate17

 

[Kasi]

Side note, I took insurance on my hand when the count called for it, and as he was going to check for the blackjack, he literally picked up his down card and top card and flashed me the bottom card. In this case he didnt have it, and I was left with having to hit a 17 versus his soft 19.

You're saying you hit a hard 17, probably with a pretty big bet out, knowing he had a 19?

If so, what a camo play

If so, no further need to worry about him thinking you're counting

Guess I'm also assuming his mistake was unintentional lol. Is that what you think? Did he always check in that same way for other Aces?

 

[summathguy]

It comes up all the time, and I know there has been a thread on personal situations coming up so I thought I would add mine.
(...)

Was the dealer **** @ ******? It sounds exactly like him.

EDIT: Not the carelessness and/or deliberate lifting of the hole card, just how you described the conversation. (I don't want to get the one good dealer in the area in trouble :\)

 

[EasyRhino]

You know, a while back there was one other player at the table. He was betting very erratically. He'd play $50 a hand, but then, about once every 10-20 hands, jump the bet up to around $500. He was not doing it in correlation with the count. He was not using any obvious progression system. If he was trying to catch aces, he was doing a horrible job at it. Anyway, it hit two bad beats on doubledowns with those big hands, and left the table.

I mentioned to the dealer that I couldn't figure out how he was betting, and the dealer responded "no, that's card counting.". To which I responded "well, if that's what card counting is like, I'll stick with losing slowly, thank you.".

(and no, I'm pretty sure it wasn't actually card counting)

 

[Doofus]

For the first time I had a dealer mention that prior to becoming a dealer he "played blackjack all the time, and counted cards, and made a good amount of money doing it, too." I nodded my head in silent approval, then said, "I've always heard that's really hard. I have enough trouble keeping track of soft hands to start doing that stuff." All in the midst of furiously counting myself.

That session turned out pretty well. That dealer is going to see me again. :grin:

 

[21forme]

For the first time I had a dealer mention that prior to becoming a dealer he "played blackjack all the time, and counted cards, and made a good amount of money doing it, too."

That's why he became a dealer - for bigger bucks :laugh: