What's the most intelligent way to use, let's say, a $50 table voucher, which will give you $50 free. Should I add it to my blackjack bankroll? Or use it on some high risk game such as roulette? I'm inclined to say just play more blackjack with it, but I'm not sure what's mathematically optimal.
Free Comped $$
- Thread starter assume_R
- Start date
tensplitter
Well-Known Member
Bet it on the pass in craps and bet $50 cash on the dont pass and $1 on the hard 12. You'll win $49 for any number rolled and $30 if the hard 12 is rolled. Or just save it until the count calls for a $50 bet in blackjack.
If it's match play, bet the voucher and $50 on pass, bet $100 on dont pass and $3 on 12.
If it's match play, bet the voucher and $50 on pass, bet $100 on dont pass and $3 on 12.
FLASH1296
Well-Known Member
These sort of things are almost always restricted to even-money wagers, with many restrictions, (e.g. don't pass at Craps, Spanish21, etc.)
The redoubtable James Grosjean wrote an excellent paper on this issue.
The best bet is any single number on a roulette wheel, if ever permitted.
The redoubtable James Grosjean wrote an excellent paper on this issue.
The best bet is any single number on a roulette wheel, if ever permitted.
I was originally talking about promotional chips, in which I swipe my card at a Kiosk and they give me a voucher, which I can use for free chips. No match play needed and no strings attached. I get these free voucher things quite often.FLASH1296 said:
So looks like the answer is if it's free money, just add it to my blackjack bankroll, and if it's a match play, then play a single number on a roulette wheel? Is the paper free to download, flash?
Sonny
Well-Known Member
The PDF is free here:assume_R said:
http://www.blackjackforumonline.com/content/beyondcouponsbjfo.pdf
-Sonny-
FLASH1296
Well-Known Member
Also available on my website: http://www.mediafire.com/?0owozdo3ywx
tensplitter
Well-Known Member
Why would it be better to bet it on one number in roulette than on the dont pass line? The craps bet has a lower edge and is more likely to win. Is it because for a low amount, the money you make if the craps bet wins is not meaningful enough? But if you put, say, $10 on one number in roulette and it hits, you win $360 which is a sizable win.
Because the coupon itself has no value. Bet a $20 coupon and lose, you lose the coupon. Bet a $20 coupon and win, you win $20 and lose the coupon. If the coupon isn't lost on a win, then it becomes like real money and can just be added to your blackjack bankroll. (unless blackjacks don't pay 3:2 on the coupon's value)
Say you have a $20 coupon to use on either
A) An even money proposition paying 1:1
B) A single number on roulette paying 35:1 on a 37:1 shot.
Case A)
EV = 50%($20) - 50%(0) = $10
Case B)
EV = (1/38)*20*35 - (37/38)*0 = $18.42
The coupon is worth only half face value on the even money proposition with no house edge, but is worth over 90% of its face value on a longshot with a > 5% house edge.
House edge isn't everything when it comes to match plays and free bets.
Say you have a $20 coupon to use on either
A) An even money proposition paying 1:1
B) A single number on roulette paying 35:1 on a 37:1 shot.
Case A)
EV = 50%($20) - 50%(0) = $10
Case B)
EV = (1/38)*20*35 - (37/38)*0 = $18.42
The coupon is worth only half face value on the even money proposition with no house edge, but is worth over 90% of its face value on a longshot with a > 5% house edge.
House edge isn't everything when it comes to match plays and free bets.
The free bets I was referring to are simply chips, which I can cash out immediately at a casino cage for $$, or get 3:2 on blackjack, or whatever. Truly risk free EV. I was wondering if there's 0-risk EV, should I play some craps or roulette or something and if there was a justification for doing so.sabre said:
Blue Efficacy
Well-Known Member
If it's free cash, use them however you'd use the cash, pretty simple no?assume_R said:
tensplitter
Well-Known Member
So even if it's $50 match play where you must bet $50 of your own money and have it count as a $100 bet, would it be better to bet all of that on one number in roulette? If the number hits, that's an instant $3600 to your bankroll, but when it doesn't hit, you're out $50. It would have less variance to bet $50+coupon on pass and $100 on dont pass, that way you'll get the face value of the coupon. And bet $5 on the hard 12 to guarantee that you'll come out ahead.
Nynefingers
Well-Known Member
The point is that the higher the variance, the higher your ev. If your bankroll is such that you aren't comfortable betting $50 on something that will lose 37 out of 38 times, it may still be best to bet it on roulette, just on a lower variance bet, such as betting it on two or four numbers. Read the JG paper and it explains the math and lists the bets in order of best to worse. Work your way down the list until the bet presents a level of variance you are comfortable with.tensplitter said:
For the OP, you say they are just like cash. If that's the case, then use them like cash. If there are quirks to the chips, such as you must play through them, and you keep the promo chips on a win (so a $25 bet in promo chips wins $25 in real chips or loses $25 in promo chips, but on a win, you must play them again), then you should review the JG paper for advice on how to best bet those chips.