Part Time Expectations

[Jdesey]

hello all... just found this website and man is it good for where I am at. I just got serious about blackjack this year. I am having great sessions... my two May sessions were +1600 & +600....previous sessions this year have been break even or small losses with some wins as well.

anyway, I would like to hear from those that are playing on a consistent basis and what you have experienced. Have you become bored with it (hope not). Have you been able to win over time? How often do you play? Just looking for some real world input from others who take the game as serious as I do.

 

[EasyRhino]

I'm probably the archetype of the weekend warrior. My "career" has lasted almost a year I play on most weekends, and have had three "destination" weekend trips.

I've played enough to be satisfied that there really is an advantage to be had with this stuff. Have been able to build up the bankroll, although the variance is a bitch. (had my biggest losing session so far a month ago, and the next three sessions have only repaired the damage by 40%). Online bonus-hustling is much easier, and is really what kicked my bankroll from the red to green chip level.

It's still pretty darn fun, but at times (often after a bad loss!), there is a "time to make the donuts" feeling of slogging out to play.

 

[shadroch]

I just got in from a quick Vegas trip.Played at the lowest minumum tables in downtown,spread from table minimum to 5x minimum with zero heat anywhere and won between $100-$150 every day.Longest I played was five hours on Memorial Day.Worse I was ever down at any time was $65,but ended that morning up $37.This morning I won $150 in just over two hours,as I was on one of those very rare streaks where every double down went perfectly.On Sunday and Monday,I must have lost 3/4s of my DoubleDowns,but today I hit about 90%.
Not the slightest bit bored with it,but it will be at least eight weeks before i get back to Vegas.

 

[21forme]

I've been playing about once a week for about 8 months. I'm up about 50K. I've only had 2 down sessions, one of 1K and one of 3K.

I play a $25 or $50 unit and usually cash in for 1K when I sit down. What I find most amazing is I've only had to pull out a second or third $1K, and never beyond that, from the bankroll a handful of times.

For example, this week, I started off badly, losing 1K in my first 15 minutes (good count, bad variance) and pulling out a second 1K. However, about 45 minutes later I was cashing out 5K in chips.

I'm just waiting for that bad run - I know it has to happen.

 

[3aces]

Been playing for 4 months - 150 hrs of play on 6 trips. Was riding high, with profit of 150 units, and then took a 75 unit bath in one trip to Vegas. I mostly play DD with a spread of 1-8 with sessions of 1-3 hrs depending on how often I push out my max bet. Also some 6D backcounting.
It does seem to have potential as a small source of extra income, if:
-you understand and can weather the periods of negative variance. Or as someone said "embrace the losses"
-you can tolerate the negatives of the environment (second hand smoke, sedentary activity, time alone)
-you learn to enjoy the "art" of the cat and mouse game with the casinos as much as the "science" of counting. Its kinda fun to hustle out of a place after you realize the pit is on the phone staring your way after you had a nice run at max bet
-you learn from mistakes. Among my many (so far)... overbetting my bankroll, playing with a partner without studying how it should be done, being too stone faced and serious (you can learn to laugh talk joke and still count), getting backed off after stupidly playing the same store for 15 hrs in 2 days, not studying the impact of table rules early on, assuming Vegas was a good place to play when in fact the table rules are better elsewhere.

EasyRhino's thread is great info on real road experience
Good luck!

 

[Automatic Monkey]

The important thing to remember as a part-timer with another source of income is the value of our time. Risk of ruin isn't as important in betting decisions because we are never really ruined, unless we are going into debt for bankroll or something crazy like that. When I go on a mission I fit my game for a 2-5% risk of ruin for that trip and fortunately I've never had to abort a mission due to trip ruin.

So I refuse to play BJ for less than I make per hour at my full time job. I'll hear guys talking about a game that is paying them $7-10 per hour win rate, and they'd be better off getting a part-time job in the supermarket. Same money, no risk.

 

[Bojack1]

The important thing to remember as a part-timer with another source of income is the value of our time. Risk of ruin isn't as important in betting decisions because we are never really ruined, unless we are going into debt for bankroll or something crazy like that. When I go on a mission I fit my game for a 2-5% risk of ruin for that trip and fortunately I've never had to abort a mission due to trip ruin.

So I refuse to play BJ for less than I make per hour at my full time job. I'll hear guys talking about a game that is paying them $7-10 per hour win rate, and they'd be better off getting a part-time job in the supermarket. Same money, no risk.

I think as a part timer you should not worry about if your win rate matches your hourly rate for your full time job. As long as you enjoy what you are doing then that should be good enough. If you make a small profit while participating in a hobby you enjoy, you are way ahead of those that need to pay to indulge in their hobby. Of course winning money would be the pinnacle of success to an enjoyable pastime, but don't let anyone ever tell you how much it should take to make your leisure time worth participating in.

 

[timh]

So I refuse to play BJ for less than I make per hour at my full time job. I'll hear guys talking about a game that is paying them $7-10 per hour win rate, and they'd be better off getting a part-time job in the supermarket. Same money, no risk.

If you're in it only for the money. Absolutely nothing wrong with that! :grin:

 

[Automatic Monkey]

If you're in it only for the money. Absolutely nothing wrong with that! :grin:

I am. I don't enjoy playing it at all. Just like a garbage man emptying a dumpster. The only things I enjoy about it are the things I do with the money. Oh and sometimes you see something really funny in a dumpster, but that's not the point.

 

[shadroch]

I am. I don't enjoy playing it at all. Just like a garbage man emptying a dumpster. The only things I enjoy about it are the things I do with the money. Oh and sometimes you see something really funny in a dumpster, but that's not the point.

Overall,my win rate is just about $10 an hour,compared to the $35 plus I pull on my"real" job.And it doesn't cost me $300 to fly to my real job.
But I enjoy BJ and regard time spent at the table as a learning experiance.
I've had days when I played everything just right and still dropped $200 on 5-10 dollar tables,but have also had days when everything has gone right and I'm making $75 an hour on the same tables.
I'm not yet mentally prepared for the crazy swings that betting a $25-150 spread would bring.The inevitable $5,000 loss would dampen my enthusiasum for the game,so I keep chugging away with my lo-roller game.

 

[biggamejames]

I guess then i am the only loser on this forum...

i have actually won about 60k in the last 2 months...But i am down 15k overall.:laugh:

I know, you must be wondering, how in the heck i am down 15k if i won 4 times that.

Here is the easy answer. I am a greedy little piggie. On many of my sessions i have actually started out great. Winning over 500 to start out the session before disaster struck and i would lose it all back to the house plus more.

Even on the days where i started out losing money, i have very rarely blown my br to the last penny. Normally what would happen is that i would lose about 80% then win it all back. Instead of walking away even, i would continue play and lose it right back! I have had some brutal ass sessions where i lost about 90% of my br and won it back about 3 times in the same sitting. That is the equivalent of winning about 3 times my BR then losing it right back. (btw, when i say BR, i mean my br for the day. My daily BR when playing is 1k. But since i started card counting, i have found out that i only need 500. So now if i lose 500, i take a break then return hours later and continue from there with another 500.)

I am now averaging about 20 days of BJ play a month. Playing mostly on weekdays. Of late my daily hours of play are seriously declining.
Last week i think i averaged about 5.5 hours of play a day. In the months before that, i was easily clocking 8-9 hours of play. (but this is mostly due to my change in outlook of the game and the fact that i can now easily walk away from a table whether i am winning or losing and of course the fact that i find i win more now that i really keep the count and play to it as oppossed to when i was just muddling through it.)

 

[sagefr0g]

those were some sweet sessions $1600 and $600. i've never realized anything close in my play. $220 in one session was the most i ever pulled off. i believe that happened twice. i've played 206 sessions on a fairly consistant basis (about three or four days per week). my sessions were mostly between one and three hours in length with a rare five hour session from time to time. my average was $30/session winnings. i'd play mainly five dollar tables and wong out on those a lot. rarely i'd play ten dollar tables again agressively wonging out. occasionally i'd wong in on some fifteen dollar and twenty five dollar tables. my expectation is around $9/hour give or take a few dollars. so i experienced a lot of positive fluctuation. that is up untill my last three sessions or so where i lost almost one seventh of my bankroll. i put a stop to my play at that time and have been putting my methods and goals under the microscope. back to the drawing board as they say.
so far i haven't come up with much. i do know that i vastly enjoy employing advantage play against casino blackjack. even so i decided that i wanted to do some other things with my time as well so i decided that i'd probably cut my playing time in about half. i have come to the realization however from my own personal perspective that the rigors of card counting when weighed along with the degree of negative fluctuation and just plain rarity of advantage opportunities that actually present to the point where i experienced some dissatisfaction over all. part of the source of my dissatisfaction stemmed from the fact that i believe i was betting over conservatively for the small advantages overall that do present. so it was as if the advantage was even rarer than it actually is. the other aspect that was a source of my dissatisfacticion was what to me is a rather mind numbing stiffling degree of rigor one needs to employ inorder to keep the count in the orthodox way. i've found that i'm able to employ what i call a 'fuzzy' count through simply watching the cards that come out and the number of decks in the discard tray on a round by round basis. i'm able to employ what for me are more natural modes of mind wherein i can use judgement and thoughtful reasoning with respect to determining the qualitative value of the current game i find myself involved in. i'm still able to come up with what i consider degrees of advantage for which to bet up on. this all still requires perfect basic strategy play but the betting and basic strategy departure aspect becomes subject to the fuzzyness of the 'count'. i still have to practice on a regular basis to keep up a level of skill. but now instead of practicing counting down a deck of cards i play tons of blackjack on the computer with cvbj. then i can check out the playing log and see if i've been making my bet increases at appropiate times according to the actual TC. i can also check the TC when i decide to wong out inorder to acertain if i've based my decision to leave the table at an optimun time.
so far i've only played my local joint a few times since my blackjack sabbatical and the results have been about the same as when i was using orthodox methods. not proof of anything one way or the other i realize but thats my story up until now.

 

[zengrifter]

hello all... just found this website and man is it good for where I am at. I just got serious about blackjack this year. I am having great sessions... my two May sessions were +1600 & +600....previous sessions this year have been break even or small losses with some wins as well.

anyway, I would like to hear from those that are playing on a consistent basis and what you have experienced. Have you become bored with it (hope not). Have you been able to win over time? How often do you play? Just looking for some real world input from others who take the game as serious as I do.

Do you know the correct basic strategy? zg