question about bankroll and when to stop

[brodaiga]

i'm a new player and am waiting on the knock out book. I played with bs a couple times, i live 50 miles from ac.

my question is, say for example my bankroll is $500 or even $1000. When I make a trip and intend to play say 10 hours for that day, when should I stop?

Should I stop when I double my money? Should I never stop and play out the 10 hours?

Should I quit if 50% of the bankroll is gone? 75% is gone, and if it happens all is gone?

When I get my back I will do some research and calculate my RoR based on my situation, however, any answers to the above questions would be helpful

 

[la_dee_daa]

you should bring enough money for how long the trip is going to be to subtain almost any variation so you always have enough to play with. you dont want to loss everything or stop just because. also you need more than $500-$1000. more like 5k to 10k for you br. or make it replenishable and all.

 

[brodaiga]

you should bring enough money for how long the trip is going to be to subtain almost any variation so you always have enough to play with. you dont want to loss everything or stop just because. also you need more than $500-$1000. more like 5k to 10k for you br. or make it replenishable and all.

thanks for the help, more questions follow:

Minimal travel and stay expenses = ) I was planning on going twice a month for 20 hours total a month. playing $10 games, $5 if I can find them. Just learning how to count well to one day move on to higher limits.

Say, I have two sessions in my first month and I am down $1500 or up $1500.

1.How much do I take out for personal use?
2.do I have to always go back next time with the full bank roll or the depleted one?

3. So on a 5k bankroll, I show up with 5k in my pocket?
4.If i'm losing badly I still think I will limit my losses at around 1k-1500 and stop playing, why bring the whole 5k then with me?
5. Should I be prepared to go down to 0 in the unlikely event it happens on any particular trip?
6. For $5 to $10 games should my max bets at positive counts be around $50 to $100?
7. how large should my bank roll be based on #6?
8. based on 10 hours of play at ten dollar tables using the RO system, and Il-18 I wonder what my risk of losing my 5k bankroll is in a couple months?
9. unrelated but, at the low limits I play should I get a player's card and reveal my identity so I can benefit from the comps when my girl and I want to stay in ac and party?

Sorry for all the questions, any answers or personal experiences would be awesome. Learning to count is one thing, but learning to manage money is just as important. I think the statistics should be in the player's favor as well

 

[SD Padres]

thanks for the help, more questions follow:

Minimal travel and stay expenses = ) I was planning on going twice a month for 20 hours total a month. playing $10 games, $5 if I can find them. Just learning how to count well to one day move on to higher limits.

Say, I have two sessions in my first month and I am down $1500 or up $1500.

1.How much do I take out for personal use?
2.do I have to always go back next time with the full bank roll or the depleted one?

3. So on a 5k bankroll, I show up with 5k in my pocket?
4.If i'm losing badly I still think I will limit my losses at around 1k-1500 and stop playing, why bring the whole 5k then with me?
5. Should I be prepared to go down to 0 in the unlikely event it happens on any particular trip?
6. For $5 to $10 games should my max bets at positive counts be around $50 to $100?
7. how large should my bank roll be based on #6?
8. based on 10 hours of play at ten dollar tables using the RO system, and Il-18 I wonder what my risk of losing my 5k bankroll is in a couple months?
9. unrelated but, at the low limits I play should I get a player's card and reveal my identity so I can benefit from the comps when my girl and I want to stay in ac and party?

Sorry for all the questions, any answers or personal experiences would be awesome. Learning to count is one thing, but learning to manage money is just as important. I think the statistics should be in the player's favor as well

If your max bet is $100 then I would say your total bankroll should be at least $5000. I would break this up into 10 playing sessions. Meaning, your session bankroll would be $500. However, if you are going to be in one location playing for an extended time you could have several sessions but you need to walk away if you are down $500 from any one session.
The scary thing is...you could have 10 losing sessions in a row and deplete your bankroll very quickly. That's why bankroll is such a huge factor and the downfall of many counters. The numbers above are very aggressive and you may want to play smaller stakes until your bankroll is substantial. Your max bet should be no more than 2% of your total bankroll and some here (including myself) would suggest no more than 1%.

 

[brodaiga]

thanks for the advice...keep em coming

 

[la_dee_daa]

1. try to keep your br seperate from other stuff.
2. you always go with a full trip bankroll when you play depending how long you plan to play this is different.
3. u just bring enough for the trip which is usually fair chunk of it.
4. if you are losing badly you keep playing the idea is with a good trip bankroll you wont run out.
5. its possible but if you bring enough and have a backup bank card or something this shouldnt be a problem but its possible.
6. well first for ac you should probably backcount alot to overcome their 8 decks i think they are. get the rules of the games you plan to play run a sim program and it will tell you what to do. i used powersim for this its free and somewhere in internet land just google it. you will need at least a 1-12 spread probably more
7. depending what you want your ror to be 7k 8k 9k 10k simulator you can figure out this to.
8. losing 5k in 10 hours would be very unlikely especailly if you are backcounting, probably more then 3 stds or something like that i would guess from my own experiences and numbers.
9. i dont play rated becuause where i live comps are terrible at best. lower limt player go for it though!!! i would if they would get me anything.. i think all i get is free parking for playing rated

myself i play to a 8-10k bankroll i started offically playing this year and im still in losing variance but have pushed over 2 standards divations negative. expect big swings it doesnt take much to lose 10-20 hands in a row with a few ties in there and if you do have a positive count money with $50-$150 on the table each time you can see why you need at least over a grand for less then an hour of play at a $10 min table.

read around this site here most answear are floating around to

 

[la_dee_daa]

If your max bet is $100 then I would say your total bankroll should be at least $5000. I would break this up into 10 playing sessions. Meaning, your session bankroll would be $500. However, if you are going to be in one location playing for an extended time you could have several sessions but you need to walk away if you are down $500 from any one session.
The scary thing is...you could have 10 losing sessions in a row and deplete your bankroll very quickly. That's why bankroll is such a huge factor and the downfall of many counters. The numbers above are very aggressive and you may want to play smaller stakes until your bankroll is substantial. Your max bet should be no more than 2% of your total bankroll and some here (including myself) would suggest no more than 1%.

you need more like 12-13 big bets for a short type session. Very easy to tap out with only 5.

 

[brodaiga]

1. try to keep your br seperate from other stuff.
2. you always go with a full trip bankroll when you play depending how long you plan to play this is different.
3. u just bring enough for the trip which is usually fair chunk of it.
4. if you are losing badly you keep playing the idea is with a good trip bankroll you wont run out.
5. its possible but if you bring enough and have a backup bank card or something this shouldnt be a problem but its possible.
6. well first for ac you should probably backcount alot to overcome their 8 decks i think they are. get the rules of the games you plan to play run a sim program and it will tell you what to do. i used powersim for this its free and somewhere in internet land just google it. you will need at least a 1-12 spread probably more
7. depending what you want your ror to be 7k 8k 9k 10k simulator you can figure out this to.
8. losing 5k in 10 hours would be very unlikely especailly if you are backcounting, probably more then 3 stds or something like that i would guess from my own experiences and numbers.
9. i dont play rated becuause where i live comps are terrible at best. lower limt player go for it though!!! i would if they would get me anything.. i think all i get is free parking for playing rated

myself i play to a 8-10k bankroll i started offically playing this year and im still in losing variance but have pushed over 2 standards divations negative. expect big swings it doesnt take much to lose 10-20 hands in a row with a few ties in there and if you do have a positive count money with $50-$150 on the table each time you can see why you need at least over a grand for less then an hour of play at a $10 min table.

read around this site here most answear are floating around to

thanks for the answers man, so you don't just sit down a table a play for a couple hours flat betting on the negatives and raise on the positive counts. you backcount and wong in and out all day? I wonder which system I should do

 

[la_dee_daa]

thanks for the answers man, so you don't just sit down a table a play for a couple hours flat betting on the negatives and raise on the positive counts. you backcount and wong in and out all day? I wonder which system I should do

KO like u said in your first post is good. i play from 30min- 3 hrs but the longer session is with friends. It all depends on the condtios that day if i wong or what if the casino is emopty with a few people on each table i wong or find a new empty table and play heads up till the count goes fairly bad then siwtch. sometimes play the first deck in a shoe if positive say if negative leave. its never good to play negative counts becuase you will loss money in the overall. Also dont play at crowded tables all the cards get eaten up really fast and the count just never really does anything good, this make $5 tables pretty much not worth playing where i play since they are alwyas full. with 8 deck shoes and a $5000 br or what ever you can t afford to play through to many negative counts.

 

[brodaiga]

KO like u said in your first post is good. i play from 30min- 3 hrs but the longer session is with friends. It all depends on the condtios that day if i wong or what if the casino is emopty with a few people on each table i wong or find a new empty table and play heads up till the count goes fairly bad then siwtch. sometimes play the first deck in a shoe if positive say if negative leave. its never good to play negative counts becuase you will loss money in the overall. Also dont play at crowded tables all the cards get eaten up really fast and the count just never really does anything good, this make $5 tables pretty much not worth playing where i play since they are alwyas full. with 8 deck shoes and a $5000 br or what ever you can t afford to play through to many negative counts.

hmm, one more question, if I walk around looking for positive counts,and leave on the negs, when betting on the positive ones, I am always betting my max bet, ie 1-2% of the bankroll. So you basically walk around looking for TC+2, make a couple of max bets, when it goes down below -1, you flat bet a couple times and move on to the next one?

This seems kind of risky because you are always betting the max bet. I guess you have the best long term advantage though.

 

[la_dee_daa]

hmm, one more question, if I walk around looking for positive counts,and leave on the negs, when betting on the positive ones, I am always betting my max bet, ie 1-2% of the bankroll. So you basically walk around looking for TC+2, make a couple of max bets, when it goes down below -1, you flat bet a couple times and move on to the next one?

This seems kind of risky because you are always betting the max bet. I guess you have the best long term advantage though.

more like +2 2 units +3 4 units +4 6 units +5 12+ units.
you base your your bets on the advantage you have at certain counts 13.3%or what ever ror you bet 1% of your br on a 1% advantage. for every count of +1 true count for hi lo that is you get about .5% more on your side or something

 

[Richard Pugh]

more like +2 2 units +3 4 units +4 6 units +5 12+ units.
you base your your bets on the advantage you have at certain counts 13.3%or what ever ror you bet 1% of your br on a 1% advantage. for every count of +1 true count for hi lo that is you get about .5% more on your side or something

So that means if it's a $5 table and your flat bet is $5 then when the counts gets to +2 you bet $10 and when (if) it got to +5 you'd be staking something like £60 ?

And if your max bet should be no more than 2% of your bankroll you need $3000 before you start playing?

 

[la_dee_daa]

So that means if it's a $5 table and your flat bet is $5 then when the counts gets to +2 you bet $10 and when (if) it got to +5 you'd be staking something like £60 ?

And if your max bet should be no more than 2% of your bankroll you need $3000 before you start playing?

yea basically.. with a $3000 br you would have a 10%-20% ror though.
you really need like min $5000 to keep your ror down. most people feel max bet shouldnt be more then 1% you can go a little over but its better to base it on the advnatage but its a good rule to go by.

you can use a replenishable bankroll so you dont need all the money in pocket at once.

:cow:

 

[brodaiga]

yea basically.. with a $3000 br you would have a 10%-20% ror though.
you really need like min $5000 to keep your ror down. most people feel max bet shouldnt be more then 1% you can go a little over but its better to base it on the advnatage but its a good rule to go by.

you can use a replenishable bankroll so you dont need all the money in pocket at once.

:cow:

wait, I thought the 1% was the flat bet amount not the maximum one is willing to bet, or is it the other way around?

According to Renzy's book, he breaks the Ror down by the number of horus you are playing, and suggests the Ror analyzer program by Austin to calculate bankroll or using the square root rule. Do you guys do this stuff?

 

[la_dee_daa]

wait, I thought the 1% was the flat bet amount not the maximum one is willing to bet, or is it the other way around?

According to Renzy's book, he breaks the Ror down by the number of horus you are playing, and suggests the Ror analyzer program by Austin to calculate bankroll or using the square root rule. Do you guys do this stuff?

no the 1% should be your max bet maybe a little more if you flat bet was 1% you would only have 100 units. most people just use different sims which figure that stuff out. i just play around with my sim for different BRs and rors with different bet spreads.