Surrender 16 vs. Stand Multi's

[eps6724]

O.K., I don't think this has been discussed, and I can't find it in any book that I have (Note to another thread: YES, I read books and YES I study)

Anyway, when playing surrender option, I was wondering about multi-hand 16's. Yes, I know the "rule of 45" and I know that many people might have different "rules" on if/when they stand on multi 16's. But specifically-in a game where you would surrender 16 v. 10, how do you handle the 3 or 4 (or even 5) card 16? I am leaning towards playing it as a usual 16-hit, hit, hit until rule of 45 or you get a decent hand (or, more likely bust) but would like to know from people who have "been there done that".

EPS

 

[shadroch]

Perhaps the reason it isn't discussed much is that almost every surrender game is surrender after your first two cards only.The only time I've seen surrender on three or more cards is on gimmick games like Superfun 21

 

[Renzey]

Specifically-in a game where you would surrender 16 v. 10, how do you handle the 3 or 4 (or even 5) card 16? I am leaning towards playing it as a usual 16-hit, hit, hit until rule of 45 or you get a decent hand.

EPS -- I'm just a bit foggy on your question. If you have a multi-card 16, that means you started with something less than 16, such as say, 13 -- then hit and caught a 3. Since you wouldn't have surrendered 13, you are now in normal playing mode. So if you don't count cards, you'd play the "rule of 45", and if you do count, you'd play your "hit/stand" index for 16 vs. 10.

You mentioned previously that you were learning KISS. So in a six deck game, you would now stand on your 16 at an R/C if "15" or higher -- or -- to true count mode this important play, you'd just stand anytime your R/C is higher than "normal" for the current shoe depth (since your IRC is "9", when you're one deck into the shoe "11" would be normal. Two decks in is "13", three in is "15", four in is "17", etc.)

Was there some other instance you were referring to?

 

[EasyRhino]

Fred's got it nailed, as usual.

1) The surrender decision overrides the hit/stand decision. So if you can surrender, do it. (if they somehow let you surrender with 3 cards, go for it)

2) If you're counting, the count trumps decisionmaking in favor of little rules of thumb like the "multicard rule" or the "rule of 45".

3) If you're not counting, then the random rules of thumb will trump strict total-dependent basic strategy.

4) Total-dependent basic strategy trumps wild-ass guessing.

 

[shadroch]

So the option to surrender on three cards is common? Where?

 

[Mimosine]

So the option to surrender on three cards is common? Where?

no it isn't. it is non-existent.

 

[eps6724]

Sorry not to be more clear-I was referring to games where surrender (on first two cards) was allowed, whether this changed the strategy AFTER the option has passed-i.e., on your 3rd card or more leads to 16 v. 10. My assumption was that you would play these hands the same way each time, and it would seem that that is correct. Probably a stupid question to begin with.

So, sorry for not being clear enough, but you have answered my questions, thanks!

-EPS

 

[zengrifter]

no it isn't. it is non-existent.

Actually its available on several variations, most notably SuperFun and Spanish 21. Neither of which should most counters be playing. zg

 

[Mimosine]

Actually its available on several variations, most notably SuperFun and Spanish 21. Neither of which should most counters be playing. zg

neither of those are BJ - which is what i was clearly referring to....
cheater