Taking a hit...

zengrifter

Banned
Taking a hit: New blackjack odds further tilt advantage toward the house
By Jeff Haney
<[email protected]>
LAS VEGAS SUN

Some oddball blackjack-like games in the Las Vegas area:

Super Fun 21: Blackjacks pay even money in this single-deck game, but there are also all kinds of crazy rules that benefit the player. Generally considered a carnival game rather than a form of mutant blackjack. (Note: Many gamblers use the term "carnival game" to describe casino table games that are unworthy of serious consideration or just plain goofy.)

Spanish 21: All of the 10s are removed from the deck, and there are lots of other weird rules as well. A carnival game that's unpopular with the public, for good reason.

Dealt-to-the-bottom:

Poker Palace in North Las Vegas offers a gimmicky single-deck game in which blackjacks pay even money, but the deck is dealt out all the way to the last card. With a paltry $50 maximum bet and a large house advantage, this game is considered a mere curiosity piece.

-- By Jeff Haney

Source material: Current Blackjack News (bj21.com)

Mario Puzo once compared the house's edge in a casino game to a sharp sword.

In modern-day Las Vegas, that sword has grown considerably sharper.

Many casinos now offer blackjack games in which blackjacks pay off at odds of 6-5 rather than the traditional 3-2 that is, $6 for a $5 bet rather than $7.50 for a $5 bet.

It might not seem like a significant issue to many players, who tend to think, "Hey, I got a blackjack; I'm getting paid anyway."

But that minor adjustment in the odds can make a major dent in a player's bankroll.

Take, for example, a blackjack player who uses proper "basic strategy" meaning he knows when to hit, stand, double down and split. Let's say he bets $10 a hand and plays 100 hands per hour.

At a decent six-deck blackjack game dealt from a shoe such as those at the Palms, the MGM Grand and elsewhere he would lose an average of $2.60 in that hour, according to computer analyses.

At a good single-deck blackjack game such as those at the Las Vegas Club and elsewhere he would lose an average of $1.80 in that hour.

At a game that pays 6-5 for blackjacks, however, our hero can expect to lose more than $14 an hour.

In other words, he will lose his money at least five times more quickly at a 6-5 game than at a shoe game, and eight times more quickly than at an old-fashioned single-deck game.

Fools die, indeed.

"This is incredibly stupid," said UNLV professor Bill Thompson, who studies gaming issues. "Everybody knows blackjacks pay 3-2. Unless they're giving out free bottles of whiskey to everyone who sits down at the table, I don't know why anybody would play this game."

Thompson, tongue in cheek, suggested 6-5 blackjack rode into Las Vegas on the same wave as topless swimming pools and sexy pirate shows on the Strip.

"Maybe the casinos think that everyone coming to Las Vegas is thinking below the belt instead of with their brains," Thompson said.

Other gambling experts say the change in odds is so extreme that the 6-5 game shouldn't even be called blackjack; that some casinos have been misleading in the way they promote the game; and that if the 6-5 game continues to proliferate, it could cause tourists to view Las Vegas casinos as unnecessarily greedy.

They also place some blame on the players, though, for failing to do at least a little bit of homework before approaching the green baize: If you play a 6-5 game and lose your money, well, to paraphrase gamblin' man Jimmy Buffett, it's your own damn fault.

Bad 'dream'

According to John Scarne's classic reference book, "New Complete Guide to Gambling," blackjacks have paid off at odds of 3-2 since 1912, when the American form of blackjack became popular in the betting parlors of Evansville, Ind.

Any game with substandard odds should not be called blackjack and should be avoided, says Don Schlesinger, author of "Blackjack Attack: Playing the Pros' Way."

"Everyone should avoid the (6-5) game because, quite simply, it isn't blackjack anymore," said Schlesinger, interviewed via telephone. "Naturals need to pay 3-2 for the average player to have a fair shot at winning money at the game."

There are 159 blackjack tables with the 6-5 odds at 24 casinos in the Las Vegas area, and the game is spreading quickly, according to the monthly tip sheet Current Blackjack News.

Al Rogers, manager of the website bj21.com and a semi-retired professional gambler, tried to persuade state officials to prohibit casinos from calling the 6-5 game "blackjack."

"People are being scammed, and I don't like to see them being ripped off," Rogers said in an interview at his office near Decatur Boulevard and Flamingo Road. "It's like the casinos are saying, 'If you're not a complete sucker, you can't play.' "

Rogers stated his case in an impassioned three-page letter to the Gaming Control Board and the Gaming Commission on March 28.

"If this game is allowed to continue, the Commission and/or the Board should require the casinos to post large, prominent signs reading 'Short Pay Table,' " Rogers wrote.

Rogers' plea was rejected.

"It falls within the guidelines" of acceptable games, said Keith Copher, the Gaming Control Board's chief of enforcement. "People are not happy about it; they'd rather have the higher 3-2 payout. But the 6-5 game does fall within the guidelines."

Some of the promotional campaigns linked to 6-5 blackjack have also drawn fire -- and ridicule -- from gamblers.

For instance, an advertisement on the electronic sign at Bally's on the Strip reads: "Now at Bally's and Paris ... By Popular Demand ... Single Deck Blackjack."

The promo neglects to inform the gaming public that it's 6-5 blackjack, the inferior game.

"I find it misleading," said Michael Shackleford, a Las Vegas-based gaming consultant. "I seriously doubt that many people are demanding a game like this."

Norm Wattenberger, a blackjack expert and creator of the "Casino Verite" computer software, cracked: "Soon we'll see, 'For extra excitement, both dealer cards are hidden!' "

Officials with Park Place Entertainment, the parent company of Bally's and Paris, did not respond to a request for comment for this story.

Also, in a recent promotional letter, Harrah's informed lucky gamblers that "every blackjack player's dream has come true ... yep, single deck games."

The letter went on to describe a game at The Rio in which blackjacks pay not 3-2, not 6-5, but even money. This game has the worst odds of any blackjack game currently being dealt anywhere in the world.

"Imagine a company so nefarious that it would purposely lie to players," Schlesinger said. "Harrah's should be ashamed of itself."

Officials with Harrah's Entertainment Inc., parent company of Harrah's and The Rio, did not respond to a request for comment for this story. Officials with Station Casinos, MGM MIRAGE and Mandalay Resort Group also did not respond to requests for comment on 6-5 blackjack.

Stanford Wong, author of the seminal "Professional Blackjack," said that while casino management has every right to offer 6-5 blackjack, the game should be portrayed accurately in promotional material.

"There have been instances of 6-5 not being presented honestly," Wong said. "The first casino ad I saw for 6-5 called it a 'whopping' 6-5, as if 6-5 were bigger than 3-2. Yes, 6 is bigger than 3, but 6-5 is not bigger than 3-2."

Anthony Curtis, publisher of the Las Vegas Advisor newsletter, took the side of the casinos' marketing departments.

Well, sort of.

"Things like demand and dreams coming true, that stuff can't be quantified," Curtis said. "It's hype. Casinos are allowed to hype their product.

"But, if they want to market it like that, they have to realize they're fair game for a guy like me who's going to call them on it and tell them they're full of (malarkey)."

Myth-information

Using basic strategy at the blackjack table does not erase the house's advantage, but it does afford the player a good run for his money. Which is why blackjack, rather than Casino War or the Big Six wheel, is by far the most popular table game in Nevada.

A second reason for blackjack's popularity is the perception that it's a game of skill, not luck. From the publication of Dr. Ed Thorp's "Beat the Dealer" in 1962 to the Caesars Palace scene in "Rain Man" to last year's "Bringing Down the House," a book that chronicled the adventures of a high-level, card-counting team, books and movies have promoted the mythology that savvy gamblers can win piles of money from the casinos at blackjack.

The reality is that for every proficient card counter, there are probably hundreds of poseurs who think they have the right stuff -- but as far as being a threat to the casino's bankroll, they're more like Kenny from "South Park" than the late Kenny Uston, the legendary card counter.

The blackjack games that pay 6-5 could eventually destroy that mythology, says Wattenberger, the gambling software developer.

"There is a symbiotic relationship between card counters and casinos," Wattenberger said. "They need each other. Forty years ago, before Thorp's book came out, table games were not nearly as popular as they are now. If it weren't for advantage players, the casinos would be wall-to-wall slots.

"The average person is never going to study (blackjack) enough to gain an advantage over the house -- but it makes them feel better knowing they're playing a game of skill. You lose that with the 6-5 games."

Curtis, the publisher and part-time star on the Travel Channel cable network, predicts players will eventually abandon 6-5 blackjack.

"Over time, bit by bit, person by person, the entire market is going to react as a single organism and people will move away from that game," Curtis said. "It will hurt the casinos in the long run."

A couple of generations ago, Horseshoe founder Benny Binion said that giving customers "good whiskey, good food and a good gamble" was the secret to his Las Vegas success.

Schlesinger, who is preparing to publish a third, revised edition of "Blackjack Attack," said 6-5 blackjack is an example of "a good gamble" becoming scarce in modern Las Vegas.

"Casino owners, in their infinite greed, seem to have no shame these days," Schlesinger said. "There are all sorts of side bets and rules variations that have been concocted to extract more money from the unwitting players."

Schlesinger did say the players should know better: "With books and websites that furnish accurate analyses of all the games, it's easy to become an informed, tough player."

Thompson, the UNLV professor, said players who are craving the single-deck experience can still satisfy their urge in Las Vegas.

The Horseshoe, for example, still offers one of the city's best single-deck games -- and no 6-5 tables.

"This is the way we've done business for 50 years, and there's no plan to change it anytime soon," a Horseshoe spokeswoman said.

As does Schlesinger, Shackleford, the gaming consultant, criticizes players for patronizing the 6-5 tables.

"To be honest, if I owned a casino, and my goal was to maximize profits, I might have some of these 6-5 blackjack games to capitalize on people's foolishness," Shackleford said.

Even so, Shackleford said, "I definitely think it's a public service to warn people about this game."

As Shackleford and many others will tell you, if you come across a table that pays 6-5 for blackjacks, don't worry about whether to hit, stand or double down.

Just split.
 

gorilla player

Well-Known Member
poor game

I was in Vegas this past June. Wife, brother, his wife and I were out sightseeing through the various strip casinos when we saw the "single-deck blackjack" sign over a table with a $10 minimum. We sat down to play for a few minutes before moving on up the strip, and on about the 3rd or 4th hand, I got a BJ. When I was paid off, I was a bit confused by getting a pair of red chips and two silver chips. I asked the dealer "didn't you make a mistake?" He said "no, BJ pays 6:5 on this game." I asked "how would one know this since it isn't on the felt surface anywhere. He took a small card out from under an ash tray and said "here" (it said "BJ pays 6:5".

We left. I then started watching more carefully and noticed that all the SD games I spotted were paying 6:5 although I did not hit anywhere near every casino in Vegas. But I thought the chintzy card was prett bad, and I noticed that in several major casinos, the signs were hardly conspicuous in where they were posted.

I had already learned to ask about "surrender", doubling, resplitting, etc rules, to avoid problems once the game started. Never occurred to me that it was also necessary to ask about the snapper payoff. I've only seen it at SD games so far, but I wonder if this will migrate further down into the multi-deck games if they can get away with it. When I asked about it and said "that's ridiculous, let's play somewhere else" one of the other players said "what's the problem with 6:5 payoff, it's better than 3:2 and we only have one deck so that 21 happens more often." I shook my head, and asked "so 3 halves is smaller than 6 fifths? - your elementary school teacher must be proud."

I know that several counters have pointed out that SF21 is beatable, but I can't stand the idea of learning a new BS and new playing rules (doubling on lots of cards, etc). I'll leave those for others to toast...

But I agree with others about the 6:5, it is bad, and the advertising is even worse... and the Nevada Gaming Commission is right in line with what I'd expect here, "hell with the "customers, the bigger the hold, the bigger the state's share (taxes)"

Of course, most people gamble driven by greed, so it's hardly a surprise to see the state driven by that same greed. :)
 

Dog Hand

Well-Known Member
How Old Is This Article?

Schlesinger, who is preparing to publish a third, revised edition of "Blackjack Attack," said 6-5 blackjack is an example of "a good gamble" becoming scarce in modern Las Vegas.

The Horseshoe, for example, still offers one of the city's best single-deck games -- and no 6-5 tables.


zengrifter,

These two quotes in particular left me wondering how old this information is. BJA's 3rd edition has been out for over half a year, and, sad to say, the vaunted Horsesh*t is indeed offering Crap Jack on all its SD tables.

Otherwise, a very good compilation of the whole sorry episode.

Dog Hand
 

Stealth Bomber

Well-Known Member
Making bad games go away...

is all about informing the public. If the public continues to be uninformed, this crap will continue for ever. Informing and teaching one person in every 1000 BJ players is just not going to fix the problem.

They are a number of people trying to do something but let's face it, it's just not enough exposure.
 
The problem is...

... that the people who understand that 6:5 is a bad game and understand why are exactly the people they don't want in their casino. They hate us. They would be happy as could be if every one of us on this website never set foot on their property again. Even a basic strategy player at a game with good rules and good comps costs them money.

So us compaining about or boycotting the game doesn't help. In fact it might give them some positive reinforcement because if card counters are complaining about it, they know they're moving in the right direction. I'd rather play the game, use advanced tactics, spread like a MF and beat it. Seeing the hold drop on those tables is something that will get their attention.
 

eyesfor21

Well-Known Member
won't work

yeapo the game is terrible,
spreading like a king still won't work,what you think all of a sudden
there is no heat jsut because its a bad game.
When its a good game is when they offer 2 to 1 for bjacks,only a selected
places offer this during promo's and the Mayor knows where too.
 

Tom

Well-Known Member
Just because

a gambler does not to play 6/5 crapjack does not mean he's a pro. You make it sound like casinos hate all 3/2 players and dont want their action because they wont play crapjack. Believe it or not,many ploppies and high rollers who lose tons of loot to casinos would not touch 6/5 with a ten foot pole and casinos are very pleased to have them. I see many lonely dealers at the 6/5 tables. To make a long story short Crapjack it certainly not a game ploppies and high rollers are waiting in line to play.
 

Stealth Bomber

Well-Known Member
If...

we could find a way to get the word out to a few million gamblers that the games mentioned above are the worst form of BJ, it could have an impact and could loosen the rules on those games. Question is: How is this best done in the easiest and least expensive way?
 

Tom

Well-Known Member
6/5 is it's worst enemy.

Crapjack to me is nothing but a nuisance(another carnival game),it is nowhere near(not even close) to the threat of when CSM's first appeared,NOW THAT WAS A NIGHTMARE. As we now know, csms are no longer a threat. Just as ploppies learned to hate CSMs for their losses,I believe the same will apply to Crapjack. In other words no bang for the buck and ploppy voodoo will cripple the game into check. Trying or attempting to convince card counters to beat this game using ridiculous spreads in order to reduce hold is a risky and unworthy adventure that wll never work. It's much easier to simply walk up to the table,buy $500 bucks in chips and leave while complaining out loud how you thought this was REGULAR blackjack. Congratulations, you've just decreased the hold with no risk and also spoke of disaproval for the bloody game! Maybe try it again on next shift:)!???
 

gui

Member
Making money with 6:5 !!!

I got you!!,

Maybe we should sell T-
shirts with "no 6:5" logo on them
 

Gorgon

Member
The scare-off

Those atrocious 6/5s are the beasts that induced me to design a counting system for Super Fun. This game is tailor-made for a pro because only a pro is going to put in the time and effort to master it. Not so with the reckie player. He'll be getting his clock cleaned no matter what one-decker he enters. Goodie. The casinos get what they want and maybe they will leave the rest of us unmolested.
 

Dog Hand

Well-Known Member
Coiner of "Crapjack" *LINK*

gorilla player,

Much as I'd like to claim credit, the originator (as far as I know) of the term "crapjack" as applied to the 6:5 game is none other than Dallas Barrister, who coined the term in a GC post just over a year ago on November 26, 2003. Click the link below.

My own entry into the "Name the 6:5 Abomination" contest was "HiJack", since that's what the casino is doing to your $$$. Other notable offerings included CG21 (Corporate GREED 21), Gypjack, Short Pay Blackjack™, RipoffJack, and One Jack Off.

Maybe we need another naming contest, Mayor?

Dog Hand
 

gorilla player

Well-Known Member
not surprised...

It's expected that good players will learn to exploit new games. I've looked at SF21 a bit, but the BS is different enough from normal BJ and I don't play often enough to really try to stay boned up on both games. Ergo, I'm probably not going to play SF unless something goes really wrong with BJ. Of course, things are going really wrong in places. 50% pen ruins DD. 6:5 ruins a lot of SD. Shoes with shallow pen have huge variance. Etc.

Glad you are doing well at it however, perhaps it will be in my future if the casinos remain so paranoid about SD/DD games...
 
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