The Definitive Card Counting System for 2-Decks?

[RPFeinman319]

Hi all, long time lurker, and avid reader here. I've been searching high and low in the literature for the answer to this question: What is the best system to use under the following circumstances: 2-Deck, approx 2/3 pene, H soft 17, DA2, resplitting okay up to 4 times (Aces only once), no DAS?

I've been using Hi/Low, with appopriate indices, for a while, and so far, I've discovered 2 things: I need to practice a LOT more, and I need to keep my emotions in check while I play. I am aware that I am VERY much a beginner, and am wondering if I play often enough: 1-2 times per week, 3-4 hours per stretch. Should I break it down into 6 1-hour sessions, or play 6 hours on a Saturday, or keep it at the same pace?

I'm in awe of you guys - literally. Keeping in mind the BS rules, not to mention starting to count, keeping track of cards seen, and money management...let's not forget that.:cool2:

Also, if anyone could direct me to a good source for BS and BS variations based on count (for these specific rules), I'd be eternally grateful.

In retrospect, I see that I've asked a few more questions than I set out to. Sorry for the long post, and if I've asked an idiotic question, I do apologize.

Thanks!

Will

 

[Mimosine]

Hi all, long time lurker, and avid reader here. I've been searching high and low in the literature for the answer to this question: What is the best system to use under the following circumstances: 2-Deck, approx 2/3 pene, H soft 17, DA2, resplitting okay up to 4 times (Aces only once), no DAS?


Also, if anyone could direct me to a good source for BS and BS variations based on count (for these specific rules), I'd be eternally grateful.

Will

i'd trust this place:
http://wizardofodds.com/blackjack/strategy/2deck.html

 

[bj bob]

Glad to here from you

Welcome aboard RPF,
I play mostly double deck myself. There's always debate as to what the best system is to employ I believe UB Zen is a favorite,as well as a few others. As for myself, it use RAPM which is a form of Hi-Lo with an ace sidecount. The most important thing, however, is not necessarily which sysytem you use, it's the deck pen, the number of mistakes you make and betting within your bankroll. If you're using Hi-Lo make sure your counting is one the money....Practice,practice,practice. BS index variations are more significant in 2D than shoe games, so the more the merrier, just don't go overboard to cause you mistakes. I use 60 myself and some of us here use many more. My advice, start with the biggies ala. I-18 and add to that as you become more comfortable.
Finally, don't let emotions take over or you're dead meat! Consider youself as a data entry processor and simply make the plays mechanically. Sounds hard, but it's the only way. Emotions can overtake your play because of two major reasons. 1) You're not perpared enough to keep the count, know BS thoroughly, and betting improperly. 2)Your're overbetting. Too many folks can't afford to play at certain stakes and, with a limited bankroll you're putting too much pressure on yourself to win and win now. If you need help with this area, just bring it up on the forum here and one of our "wise guys" will explain everything in detail. Hope this gets you started.

 

[RPFeinman319]

Mimosine, thanks for the pointer...thats the one I'm currently using. Nice to know I'm on the right track (just out of the station, though ).

BJ Bob, thanks also for the information...You guessed it right on the button: I am a SUCKER for digging into my wallet for more than I promised myself I'd lose (and more than I promised I'd bring in the door! ) I hope throwing good money after bad is something I can overcome quickly. Haven't bitten too deeply into the BR yet, just played more than 1 session's worth (in 1 session lol).

This game is a KICK...Winning or losing, just to be in the action, making the correct plays, snickering to myself when a ploppie yeslls at me for hitting 12 v 3 up...absolutely my favorite way to kill a few hours. Now I need to hone in, get SERIOUS, study study study, and sharpen my play. I play mostly at a local Indian Casino in Central WI (poorest comps in the land!), and can't wait to get some action in Wisconsin Dells. Anyone played there that can offer some insights?

Thanks again, everyone for sharing your time and talents!

Will

 

[Mimosine]

Mimosine, thanks for the pointer...thats the one I'm currently using. Nice to know I'm on the right track (just out of the station, though ).

by no means am i an expert mind you, but having only recently learned BS I have combed over countless tables, and they are almost identical. Occasionally there are a few varriations, most notably based on DAS or H17, but from what I've learned some of these more subtle differences have very little effect on the overall odds.

In Knock-Out Blackjack, the authors advocate learning one BS chart for ALL games. I'm a fan of this approach, but in learning a simple chart I've also found it useful and EASY to understand when and how to change it based on rules changes, especially the way they spelled it out. but hey, that's me.

if you're only going to play 2-deck, then learning a 2 deck chart is the way to go. i only play 6-deck so i did the same initially.

 

[zengrifter]

As for myself, I use RAPM which is a form of Hi-Lo with an ace sidecount.

Ha! BJBob your age is showing! zg

 

[bj bob]

Those who live in glass houses...

Look who's talkin'! At least I'm not old enough to have had personal lessons from Specks himself. Touchee.... Maybe sometime we can hook up and go over old times at a rippin' Tony Benett at concert at Jessie Beck's and get loaded on Geritol. I'll pick you up at Cannon Field in Reno.

 

[SystemsTrader]

What is the best system to use under the following circumstances: 2-Deck, approx 2/3 pene, H soft 17, DA2, resplitting okay up to 4 times (Aces only once), no DAS?

Here are the top five systems using score
1. Hi-Opt II 57.43
2. Zen 56.34
3. AOII 53.01
4. Halves 50.50
5. Hi-Opt I 49.92

 

[EasyRhino]

I have a hunch that finding a DAS game would give you a bigger edge than using a fancier counting system. That sound right?

 

[zengrifter]

I would go with UBZ if I was ONLY playing 2D - SCORE equal to Zen and NO TRUE-COUNTING! zg

 

[RPFeinman319]

The Aguilar Counting System?

Anyone heard of this? The guy's trash-talking Stanford Wong and Hi-Opt, claiming much higher correlation coefficients (Actually called Wong irresponsible?!?).

http://www.sniperflashcards.com/blackjack.asp (Archive copy)

I think from his website he's using a different count altogether...single level count plus 1 or 2 side counts. Claims that you can just count what's on the table, when dealer has a ten, plus keep a side count (yawn :sleep...has anyone dealt with his system, and is it any good? I know it's only for single deck, but...intriguing, nonetheless. Anyway.

PS: I hang my head in shame and await the avalanche of ridicule sure to come my way, but...I misquoted the rules of my local casino: DAS is permitted (cringe). Don't know what I was smoking when I posted yesterday...sorry.

EasyRhino, you hit the nail on the head. Good eyes.

 

[zengrifter]

Anyone heard of this? The guy's trash-talking Stanford Wong and Hi-Opt, claiming much higher correlation coefficients (Actually called Wong irresponsible?!?).

http://www.sniperflashcards.com/blackjack.asp (Archive copy)

I think from his website he's using a different count altogether...single level count plus 1 or 2 side counts. Claims that you can just count what's on the table, when dealer has a ten, plus keep a side count (yawn :sleep...has anyone dealt with his system, and is it any good?

Aguilar is a CRACKPOT! zg

 

[Beast]

I have a hunch that finding a DAS game would give you a bigger edge than using a fancier counting system. That sound right?

I didn't run the numbers, but that sounds about right.