What the heck- self-barred?

[Automatic Monkey]

Holy cow, I was playing at a large shop on the Strip this week and a casino manager came over and told me my name was on a list of people who have barred themselves from the casino (due to a compulsive gambling problem), that I would be allowed(!) to cash my chips in but I would have to leave the casino floor.

After about 10 minutes of arguing they conceded it could be just a computer glitch and that I would be allowed to continue playing but I would be photographed. Sounds like BS to me. I was spreading heavy and winning, so I think this may have been a warning shot. So I responded by telling them no way, I don't want to play in your <expletives deleted> casino anymore and I want everyone's name because I'm going to get all of you <expletives deleted> fired for embarrassing a high roller at the table. (I'm not, but indicating that I think I am makes me sound like a real amateur. The whole purpose of standing and arguing was to act like an angry tourist.)

Now I've heard of this self-barring practice, and one of it's characteristics is that if you play after self-barring you agree to forfeit all winnings. This is what I thought might be coming. I'll be steering clear of this shop for a while.

 

[SammyBoy]

Maybe Your Wife Put Your Name on the List? ;-)

 

[Royam]

Are you not afraid casino employees might read your post and remember the incident with you?

 

[john]

He's not going back there...

 

[Royam]

Ok, but what about other casinos?

Certainly, the "incident" was recorded and casinos have a legal duty to keep tapes for a few days (don't remember how many, 7 I think).

So if surveillance people see this thread, is there no risk that his picture ends up in the Griffin book?

Royam

 

[The Mayor]

Way too paranoid

No casino person is going to read a thread, track down survellience, then try and retro-engineer who the person is. That kind of thing simply does not happen.

This site has my REAL name all over it.

I use my REAL ID when I play.

If I, by living example, am not proof enough of the fact that casinos do not monitor these sites or threads to ID players, what more do you want?

--Mayor

 

[Royam]

Not the same

You... have reached a level of fame where you are intouchable, or the crowds would be unleashed against the tortfeasors... Ok-ok...just kidding. I guess you must be right.

My paranoia comes from reading too much. One author, might be Snyder, used to organize BJ round-tables in his living-room. One casisno had a floorman drive 200 miles to infiltrate the round-table and identify counters. This was 20 years ago and I just assumed that today's living-room where place like this site... Wong recognized that his green chip is infiltrated and even a black chip membership was sold to the CEO of a Vegas Casino, who had used his real name.

Your web-site is THE first one to come when you research "card+counter" on google; you have your picture on your web-site and these guys can't smell you when you take their money... there is a problem in their system, no? Let's hope management at Griffin does not become more clever

Royam

 

[gehrig]

the issue seems to reduce to...

the universality of the relatively new procedure of "self exclusion". if one were to request self exclusion from a joint, wouldn't it be consistent with the aim of that "protection" to advise other joints in the corporate group ? would that request not similarly be sent to credit central, accessible by virtually all (nevada) licensees ? would that be an invasion of some privacy if that request were broadly distributed ?

could be a new method of legally passing information betwixt casinos, "for the good of the gambler/victim"

 

[Cyrano]

Mayor...

Just curious to what level do you go... When you play BJ, do you use any camo? Do you use a "reasonable" bet spread so you don't draw heat? Roughly speaking, how long do you play per session?

 

[The Mayor]

Yes...

>When you play BJ, do you use any camo? Do you use a "reasonable" bet spread so you don't draw heat? Roughly speaking, how long do you play per session?

This varies, of course. Typically, I am a VERY aggressive player. I spread $5 to 2x$100 at the Las Vegas Club single deck last time I was there. What I do have is a well-developed "heat-o-meter" and at the first sign of it I leave. That can even be a conversation between two bosses that I suspect is about me, or it can be a phone call where the boss turns his back to me. Of course I will use camo when needed to get the heat off, but I also freely double-down on T vs. T or A and split T's. I almost never play a session longer than 90 minutes, and usually they are much shorter.

I am a low level player, and because of this may not be of interest to many places. I certainly don't recommend my spreads or style to anyone betting "real" money, or to a would-be professional.

--Mayor

 

[The Mayor]

New lows of casino impropriety

>Holy cow, I was playing at a large shop on the Strip this week and a casino manager came over and told me my name was on a list of people who have barred themselves from the casino (due to a compulsive gambling problem), that I would be allowed(!) to cash my chips in but I would have to leave the casino floor.

Did you use your real name? If you used a made up name, there is always that chance, but if it is your real name, you have a legitimate complaint to the gaming control board about fraud.

If you were indeed being backed-off using this slimy and false argument, then the casinos have fallen to new ethical lows: using the good name of GA to harrass advantage players.

--Mayor

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Real name

Yes I was using a player's card, real name because I wanted the comps. This store is big enough that my green chip action should fly for a long time before it is considered a threat. They were so silly- if I was self-barred from their house why would I hand them a player's card with the barred name on it? That would be irrational. Of course, a CG is by his nature irrational when it comes to gambling so maybe he would do something like that.

Incidentally, the quality of ploppy play was way worse, everywhere, that anything I've ever seen in CT. Just appalling. My personal rule is that I will help ploppies with Basic Strategy info (just like some dealers do) and nothing else. This becomes a problem when the ploppy and I have the same hand and the count calls for an index play. But if I were to help every really bad player I saw this week I'd spend all my time lecturing instead of playing.

 

[suicyco maniac]

AM

I always give ploppies the advice that helps the count...if its negative I tell them to hit and split and not double and when it is high tell them to stand or double and NEVER let them split. Educating them is not worth the hassles that come with it. SM

 

[Automatic Monkey]

No I couldn't do that

It's that silly old "Golden Rule" thing of mine. I'd never give bad advice to a player because I wouldn't want it to be given to me. Think of it this way: all the expert players around here hurt their EV by being here giving us good advice for free instead of making money at the table. So the least I can do is pass it on to a lesser player than me. The ploppies do me enough good just by being there and enabling me to Wong in/out.

 

[Cyrano]

2x$100 is VERY real money to me.. ;-) The reason I ask is I'm trying to figure out how people can make 6 figures doing this. In order for you to do that, you have to be taking an average of at least a thousand out of the casinos every day you play. Anything less probably isn't worth my time, considering I still have to pay most expenses a sole proprietor will have to pay (medical, travel, taxes, etc...) Seems to me that's gonna draw scrutiny no matter what you do.

 

[rocky]

self-barring

Computer glitch, my ass...this was pure harassment. Since this is a Nevada store, they have to get you to SIGN OFF on your self barring and must be documented by dated photo or surveillance tape. If they allege a computer glitch, then screw with them in return...ask to see your self-barring document along with the dated photo. Keep in mind that this falls under the trespass law..good ole NRS207.200...time on this is only one year and you have the right to return after that. I'd raise holy hell all the way up to President/GM level since this is clearly their mistake. As far as being ID'd as a card counter and winding up in Griffin...your face is already. As a former surveillance type, I provided the pit/casino manager with recognitions in the past just to see them do absolutely nothing...if you're losing, they could care less. The only exception is good ole Tom Hyland...he'll get 86'd on general principle...they fear him that much.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

But I'm only a green chip player

This shop spends more on urinal cakes each day than they could lose to me. It's totally irrational for them to make a scene at the table and scare away the ploppies on the July 4 holiday in order to intimidate me. Plus I've never really played in Vegas before, come on, can't they tell the players without a scorecard?