When the dealer "knows" you...

Preston

Well-Known Member
I am not naming where this happened or the dealer involved.

My wife and I first got into card counting back in July. We started out learning the hi-lo system and only had the guts to do a 1-5 spread of red chips. We went to a 8d s17 DAS No Surrender, No RSA game. We stayed at the same table, no wonging, and managed to pull a $600 profit over the course of a few hours. We were tipping fairly regularly when the count was positive.

Throughout the course of the night we were winning, and the tips for the dealer were winning. In fact at one point the toke box actually started to overflow.

At one point during the night, this dealer caught me shuffle tracking and warned against card counting. I played stupid but he caught onto me but he said nothing further... since we were all making money.

We took our profits and hadn't been back to the casino since... until last night.

We walked in and low and behold that dealer was there. And he recognized us! It's 6 months later! He did things to help us out, such as exposing the burn card(s) or giving blatant tells on whether or not he had a made hand with a 10 up.

So we got caught but the dealer is helping us out. Should we continue to play there as if we get caught we're in deep shit, only stop their occasionally.. I don't know since it's the F I R S T time in a casino that has actually caught onto our team method

My wife is the counter, I'm the player. We spent a week in Vegas pulling a $25-$300 spread at several casinos and caught no heat even with another counter catching heat right next to us)
 

Sonny

Well-Known Member
Preston said:
We walked in and low and behold that dealer was there...He did things to help us out, such as exposing the burn card(s) or giving blatant tells on whether or not he had a made hand with a 10 up.
If you can't find a subtle way to encourage him to “tighten up” then you should stop playing with him. If another casino employee catches this little trick then you will both be in deep trouble. What he is doing is completely illegal and by participating you are also breaking the law. The casinos are very serious about finding this type of activity and they will prosecute to the full extent of the law.

Even though the dealer is trying to do you a favor, you absolutely must not allow this to continue.

-Sonny-
 

ScottH

Well-Known Member
Preston said:
I am not naming where this happened or the dealer involved.

My wife and I first got into card counting back in July. We started out learning the hi-lo system and only had the guts to do a 1-5 spread of red chips. We went to a 8d s17 DAS No Surrender, No RSA game. We stayed at the same table, no wonging, and managed to pull a $600 profit over the course of a few hours. We were tipping fairly regularly when the count was positive.

Throughout the course of the night we were winning, and the tips for the dealer were winning. In fact at one point the toke box actually started to overflow.

At one point during the night, this dealer caught me shuffle tracking and warned against card counting. I played stupid but he caught onto me but he said nothing further... since we were all making money.

We took our profits and hadn't been back to the casino since... until last night.

We walked in and low and behold that dealer was there. And he recognized us! It's 6 months later! He did things to help us out, such as exposing the burn card(s) or giving blatant tells on whether or not he had a made hand with a 10 up.

So we got caught but the dealer is helping us out. Should we continue to play there as if we get caught we're in deep shit, only stop their occasionally.. I don't know since it's the F I R S T time in a casino that has actually caught onto our team method

My wife is the counter, I'm the player. We spent a week in Vegas pulling a $25-$300 spread at several casinos and caught no heat even with another counter catching heat right next to us)
8 decks, 1-5 spread, no wonging, and tipping... sounds like a bad plan to me!
 

bj bob

Well-Known Member
Yeah, But thet was then...

If I've read his post right. It sounds like they started with a 1-5 spread when they were just learning the ropes. Looks like they're now at a 12:1 spread. Nothing wrong with baby steps until you've got it down cold , ala the learning curve.
 

RJT

Well-Known Member
I completely agree with Sonny on this one!. What the dealer is doing, even if it is not pre-arranged is tantamount to cheating. I know it's a great opertunity and you could make a bundle off this dealer, but unless you fancy a holiday to your local correctional facility, stay the hell out of this one.

RJT.
 

Preston

Well-Known Member
Fortunately I don't go this way very often as there are better games (6 deck, double deck) the same distance from my house.

I do have $150 in pending comps which I'm going to redeem there, but I guess I'll just stick to the poker room if I see this dealer.

Oh, and we no longer use the 1-5 pussy spread. We used that when we were still working on our system and didn't have a bankroll. Now we've got one and I am not afraid to bet a 1-20 If the count justifies it. Just I normally stick to a 1-10/ or 1/12 to avoid heat when playing 6-8 decks.
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
Preston said:
I am not naming where this happened or the dealer involved

We walked in and low and behold that dealer was there. And he recognized us! It's 6 months later! He did things to help us out, such as exposing the burn card(s) or giving blatant tells on whether or not he had a made hand with a 10 up.







What system was the dealer using to check for the Ace?
 

EasyRhino

Well-Known Member
Seeing the burn card is, in general, not a bad thing, right? However, you might tell the dealer that you don't want to see the burn card.

As for the "tells", well, that's tougher. You might wait until you get a tell that the dealer has a 20 or something. Then, stand on your 16, and tell the dealer "you know, I could totally tell you have a hand there, you should really work on your poker face before someone takes advantage of it".

Collusion is bad bad bad. After all, all you really want from the dealer is toleration, and maybe good penetration.
 

ScottH

Well-Known Member
bj bob said:
If I've read his post right. It sounds like they started with a 1-5 spread when they were just learning the ropes. Looks like they're now at a 12:1 spread. Nothing wrong with baby steps until you've got it down cold , ala the learning curve.
There is something wrong with baby steps if they are -EV! It is possible to practice BEFORE going to the casino! People always try to run before they can walk...
 

RJT

Well-Known Member
I disagree on that Scott,
Certainly when i started playing in the casino, i played straight basic strategy with minimum bets while i was getting to grips with the casino environment then introduced a small spread, felt the rush and learned to deal with that and finally built up to full play.
Some distractions - like the adrenaline rush, the lights and noise and the paranoia - you can't replicate at home and need to adjust to while playing for cash.

RJT.
 

ScottH

Well-Known Member
RJT said:
I disagree on that Scott,
Certainly when i started playing in the casino, i played straight basic strategy with minimum bets while i was getting to grips with the casino environment then introduced a small spread, felt the rush and learned to deal with that and finally built up to full play.
Some distractions - like the adrenaline rush, the lights and noise and the paranoia - you can't replicate at home and need to adjust to while playing for cash.

RJT.
You can prepare for the distractions by adding your own distractions at home. Practice counting with the TV on, listening to music, talking, etc. Going into battle before you're ready is just asking for disaster. But if anyone wants to do that, feel free!
 

Preston

Well-Known Member
ScottH said:
There is something wrong with baby steps if they are -EV! It is possible to practice BEFORE going to the casino! People always try to run before they can walk...
We did practice. HOWEVER...

When there is no money on the line it isn't as real. You aren't dealing with emotions, adrenaline... PLOPPIES, heat, bankroll management. ETC. I believe the truest form of "training" is "trial by fire."

If you play online poker.. compare the play money games to the real games. You can'tuse the play money as practice because people have nothing to lose in the play money games and play very differently.
 

zengrifter

Banned
Preston said:
At one point during the night, this dealer caught me shuffle tracking and warned against card counting.
How in hell could a dealer catch a shuffle-tracker?

Preston said:
He did things to help us out, such as exposing the burn card(s) or giving blatant tells on whether or not he had a made hand with a 10 up.
How in hell could the dealer know he had a made hand?
 

Preston

Well-Known Member
zengrifter said:
How in hell could a dealer catch a shuffle-tracker?

?
The dealer didn't pick it up. I was watching the shuffles very closely and the idiot on first base made some comment about how closely I watched the shuffles. That's when the dealer brought it up.
 

Sonny

Well-Known Member
EasyRhino said:
After all, all you really want from the dealer is toleration, and maybe good penetration.
That was part of my wedding vows (except the dealer part)!

"In sickness and in health, through good variance and bad, for poorer and much poorer, ‘til barrings make us play separately.” My wife used to call me her "ace in the hole." Now she just calls me an ace hole...at least I think that's what she's saying...

-Sonny-
 

bluewhale

Well-Known Member
Sonny said:
That was part of my wedding vows (except the dealer part)!

"In sickness and in health, through good variance and bad, for poorer and much poorer, ‘til barrings make us play separately.” My wife used to call me her "ace in the hole." Now she just calls me an ace hole...at least I think that's what she's saying...

-Sonny-
LOL!! :D
excellent
 

shadroch

Well-Known Member
Preston said:
No Mirror. No electronic device. Just a simple lift the card and peek.

I'm guessing you were Upstate.And that you could tell his down card by the way they were bent,you didn't need a dealer for that.
 
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