Why Was Cellini's MSG Deleted?
- Thread starter SammyBoy
- Start date
Mr. Cellini posted here some information that I consider very important, but also subject to independent verification. Because of the delicate nature of the information, management decided to delete it and allow those who know him best, namely the folks at bjfonline.com, to decide how/when/where to post a response.
I support CCC.com management 100% in their response to this situation.
--Mayor
I support CCC.com management 100% in their response to this situation.
--Mayor
Did Cellini's message contain libel? Did its contents violate some copyright or other kind of exclusivity or confidentiality agreement? Was it illegal in any other way?
I understand your sentiments mayor, but if the answer to those three questions above is "no," then I believe there was a wrongful act of censorship on this board. What we need are open channels of discussion within the blackjack community and broad protections of communication. We do not need the removal of controversial content.
Perhaps you are not sure if it was indeed Cellini who posted the message? Perhaps it was an imposter? If that is the case, I think you should work to confirm its veracity, and it deletion be temporary and last only until confirmation takes place.
If Cellini's message was indeed legal, I think its removal indicates a failure in management's ability to serve its members. Whether you are a newspaper editor or a Web site message board editor, you have an obligation to uphold the most stringent codes of journalistic ethics. I am not claiming that CC did not think this decision through or that it acted too rashly or quickly; I do claim it made the wrong decision.
That said, I have two additional comments. First, I do respect your right to remove posts at your discretion. Second, I don't have all the facts, so you may discount this post; however, that I don't have all the facts is the very problem with your decision and the very reason I am posting.
I understand your sentiments mayor, but if the answer to those three questions above is "no," then I believe there was a wrongful act of censorship on this board. What we need are open channels of discussion within the blackjack community and broad protections of communication. We do not need the removal of controversial content.
Perhaps you are not sure if it was indeed Cellini who posted the message? Perhaps it was an imposter? If that is the case, I think you should work to confirm its veracity, and it deletion be temporary and last only until confirmation takes place.
If Cellini's message was indeed legal, I think its removal indicates a failure in management's ability to serve its members. Whether you are a newspaper editor or a Web site message board editor, you have an obligation to uphold the most stringent codes of journalistic ethics. I am not claiming that CC did not think this decision through or that it acted too rashly or quickly; I do claim it made the wrong decision.
That said, I have two additional comments. First, I do respect your right to remove posts at your discretion. Second, I don't have all the facts, so you may discount this post; however, that I don't have all the facts is the very problem with your decision and the very reason I am posting.
CC-Management
Well-Known Member
WHOA HOLD ON THERE!
First of all the post itself was removed by the poster himself. We did not remove it. The post was addressed to Learning to count. We allowed it to be posted because it was presented as an open post and not as an E-Mail. The nature of the post was obviously personal and from what we can surmise from the posters deletion they did not want it on the Main Message board. At this time we do not know the origination of the post. We deleted subsequent posts from others in this thread because the original post disappeared. These posts were merely espressing sentements to the original post and poster. This board has always maintained its "expressed" will to promote Advantage Play by accepted card counting strategy not by wishful thinking, Voodoo, or GAMBLING Mythology. We intend on running the board on this course and on the speed of the members/posters who interactively post. We also retain the right to censure any violations of the boards rules. Freedom of speech is the American way but Advantage Play discourse is what we are about. We also have the non-Blackjack page set up for other than BJ discussions. Oh Ivy Kid we have given you unmoderated poster rights. So post on!
First of all the post itself was removed by the poster himself. We did not remove it. The post was addressed to Learning to count. We allowed it to be posted because it was presented as an open post and not as an E-Mail. The nature of the post was obviously personal and from what we can surmise from the posters deletion they did not want it on the Main Message board. At this time we do not know the origination of the post. We deleted subsequent posts from others in this thread because the original post disappeared. These posts were merely espressing sentements to the original post and poster. This board has always maintained its "expressed" will to promote Advantage Play by accepted card counting strategy not by wishful thinking, Voodoo, or GAMBLING Mythology. We intend on running the board on this course and on the speed of the members/posters who interactively post. We also retain the right to censure any violations of the boards rules. Freedom of speech is the American way but Advantage Play discourse is what we are about. We also have the non-Blackjack page set up for other than BJ discussions. Oh Ivy Kid we have given you unmoderated poster rights. So post on!
CC-Management
Well-Known Member
No problemo amigo ...
...and we do value uour oppinion!
...and we do value uour oppinion!
Re: WHOA HOLD ON THERE!
Oops ... there I go, spreading misinformation.
Management is right -- Cellini deleted his own post.
I am sure 50 people saw it before it was deleted, and that it made the rounds of attempting to be posted on other sites. I myself had a post busted at bjfonline.com that referred to the details of the post by Cellini.
Wait and see...
--Mayor
Oops ... there I go, spreading misinformation.
Management is right -- Cellini deleted his own post.
I am sure 50 people saw it before it was deleted, and that it made the rounds of attempting to be posted on other sites. I myself had a post busted at bjfonline.com that referred to the details of the post by Cellini.
Wait and see...
--Mayor
CC-Management
Well-Known Member
""My mistake, Cellini did delete his own post -- I got management in trouble on that one! I'll hear from them (soon -- maybe over a beer).
I assume the content of his post here is well known, and has been frequently posted and busted already on other sites
-Mayor""
A beer? You think your getting away for just the price of a beer. Well maybe a pitcher! Management
I assume the content of his post here is well known, and has been frequently posted and busted already on other sites
-Mayor""
A beer? You think your getting away for just the price of a beer. Well maybe a pitcher! Management
Big Cowboy
Well-Known Member
Not Illegal or Journalism
In response to Ivy Kid's post on Mr. Cellini's post being censored. Your line of reasoning is off. I am only a participant in the activities of this board. Mr. Mayor and CardCounterManagement are the ones who run this site. They already do not allow nonsense language, expletives, or over the top attacks in this--their private forum. In other words, they own the room where we all gather to talk. Ivy Kid did not object to those tenets. Their duties in screening posts have nothing to do with illegalities or journalistic integrity. A message board is privately run and not a newspaper/tv show. In other words, they make the rules, and we either follow them or we go off to something like bjfonline.com. Censorship cannot be an issue based on your line thinking. Keep in mind in a lot of cases already that there is a long lag in writing a message and actually seeing it posed up on the board. I would imagine that the messages are thus being screened for appropriate content.
In response to Ivy Kid's post on Mr. Cellini's post being censored. Your line of reasoning is off. I am only a participant in the activities of this board. Mr. Mayor and CardCounterManagement are the ones who run this site. They already do not allow nonsense language, expletives, or over the top attacks in this--their private forum. In other words, they own the room where we all gather to talk. Ivy Kid did not object to those tenets. Their duties in screening posts have nothing to do with illegalities or journalistic integrity. A message board is privately run and not a newspaper/tv show. In other words, they make the rules, and we either follow them or we go off to something like bjfonline.com. Censorship cannot be an issue based on your line thinking. Keep in mind in a lot of cases already that there is a long lag in writing a message and actually seeing it posed up on the board. I would imagine that the messages are thus being screened for appropriate content.
CC-Management
Well-Known Member
Re: Not Illegal or Journalism
What we are promoting is Advantage Play by "Card Counting" strategies and methods. We do have a non-blackjack board which we allow posting of things that are non-blackjack. We do watch for any nonsense or mischief. The main board has from the start been watched over very closely and is going to kept on course. We have in the past been tolerant of some mischief but have found that in doing so certain persons who have obvious agendas in mind run a mile within the few feet we allow them to roam. All we want is a AP web site for anyone who is interested in learning. Even the casinos.
What we are promoting is Advantage Play by "Card Counting" strategies and methods. We do have a non-blackjack board which we allow posting of things that are non-blackjack. We do watch for any nonsense or mischief. The main board has from the start been watched over very closely and is going to kept on course. We have in the past been tolerant of some mischief but have found that in doing so certain persons who have obvious agendas in mind run a mile within the few feet we allow them to roam. All we want is a AP web site for anyone who is interested in learning. Even the casinos.
Are you Saying Cellini's Post was not BJ Related?
I think anything a guy of Cellini's caliber has to say should be on the main board. Now if Cellini pulled his own post that is one thing. If you guys pulled it then I respect your right to do so, but would expect a good explanation at some point in the future once things shakeout.
I think anything a guy of Cellini's caliber has to say should be on the main board. Now if Cellini pulled his own post that is one thing. If you guys pulled it then I respect your right to do so, but would expect a good explanation at some point in the future once things shakeout.
learning to count
Well-Known Member
Re: Are you Saying Cellini's Post was not BJ Related?
Well actually I think it was supposed to be a personal note to me. I think Mr. Cellini was responding to my well wishing to him On BJF21. I asked him to put a profile on this site and to join us. As far as BJ info It was personal. I dont think any one could improve their game by it.
Well actually I think it was supposed to be a personal note to me. I think Mr. Cellini was responding to my well wishing to him On BJF21. I asked him to put a profile on this site and to join us. As far as BJ info It was personal. I dont think any one could improve their game by it.
I assume the answer is yes.
New Member
Re: Even the casinos?