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I have now read all your classes and received your advanced strategy cards in the mail.
I seem to have discovered what appears to me an inconsistency in the variations.
For my double deck game (see comments above) advice on card for when I have a 12 against a 2 is to stay if the true count is at least 4. The card would on the other hand have me hit a 13 against that same 2 with the same true count of 4. How does that make sense, to hit the 13 but to stay with the 12 with the exact same circumstances?
To be clear, the card specifically says with my 12 to hit against the 2 as long as the TC is 3 or higher and with my 13 to stay as long as the TC is higher than -1 but that results in the above advice, right?
Perhaps you are being confused by the negative index number? As you mention in your final paragraph, for a 2-deck H17 game the index for 12v2 is +3. The index for 13v2 is -1.
If the true count is +3 or higher, you should stand with 12v2. If the true count is -1 or higher, you should stand with 13v2.
In your example, you ask about what happens at a true count of 4. Since +4 is higher than both of the indexes (+3 and -1), you would stand with both 12v2 and 13v2. There is no inconsistency.
Yes, I seem to be confused as to the relationship between the index number and when you perform the alternative from basic strategy play. I latched on to this statement in your lessons.
“The general rule for understanding the Basic Strategy Variations Matrix is this: If the number in a slot is 0 or a minus, then that play is a Basic Strategy move that you should make as long as the count is higher than the number shown.”
So, 13 v2 with index -1 would mean play stay as long as count is higher than -1, like +4. What am I missing?
Of course it seems fundamental that I understand how to understand the index numbers so I will ask about the general rule above. When is that not the rule or is that always the rule? And what about when the index is positive, same general rule of playing basic strategy move as long as count is not higher than the index? Based upon what you said with 12 v 2 hitting until you get to at least +4 sounds like the answer is yes but it seems important to get this right.
Sorry, I confused myself. Let me restate my reply.
First of all, is it always the case that with an index of 0 or negative that you play basic strategy move only if the count is higher than the index, otherwise play the alternative?
Is it also the general rule that it works the opposite when the index is positive? In other words, you only play the basic strategy move if the count is equal or lower to the index? By general rule here do we also mean “always?”
Ah, I see the source of your confusion. The line you quoted from the GameMaster’s lesson is always correct when you are talking about the double or don’t double index numbers, but for hit/stand indexes it is only true for positive index numbers. That’s not helpful! Since he makes the statement in a section where he is discussing soft hand doubling, I’m sure that’s what he was thinking about, but it sure is confusing. I’ll try to come up with a way to clarify it in the lesson. (I wish I could work with him on it, but his health situation must have worsened. See GameMaster.)
Despite his wording, index numbers should not be thought of as the point at which you change from basic strategy. To see exactly what each group of index numbers does mean, see the section titled What are the different kinds of Index Numbers? near the bottom of the advanced card instructions page. Note that I don’t refer to basic strategy in that section, but instead simply explain what changes at the index number. That is a safer way of describing the meaning of index numbers, and doesn’t lead to the discrepancies that the GameMaster’s wording causes.
Thanks for the feedback. I need to figure out how to best clarify Lesson 23.
The advanced strategy chart I am using for double deck assumes surrender is an option but it is not in all the games I play. So, for 15 against a 10 where it says to surrender against a 10 or stand if TC is at least 4, I assume all I do is replace surrender with hit in this case and I am good, is that right? In other words just treat the surrenders as if they said hit but I still stand if the TC is at least as high as index.
Your article. I freely admit that I hate bad players. I’ve gotten mad several times at players not playing the right way. The last time I played this guy hit on a 12 when the dealer showed a 6. I just can’t understand that play. Of course he busts with a face card and the dealer makes her hand with a lesser card. The dealer would have bust if he doesn’t hit. I am sorry, but I just can’t stand it. The guy cost the whole table by doing that and he did that a few other times as well. But maybe I should not get mad about that. It is hard to not get mad when you have a lot on a hand and this idiot just took the card that would have busted the dealer. I don’t know how to reconcile that.
You have played a total of 200 hands and you’re up almost $5000, when betting $5 in bad counts and $50 at true +2 or higher? That is almost impossible.
You ask if you have been lucky. Well, your expected win on 200 hands of this game is probably $10 or less. Does that answer your question? 🙂 By asking this question, it is clear that you have not read much about blackjack. Get yourself a decent book and understand it before you go back.
The cards have not yet been reprinted, and orders will include this error for at least the next few months. Note that the error is only in the legend, not in the charts themselves. It is still clear what the correct strategy is for each decision. Even in the legend, it is pretty easy to see that one of the “Double” instructions should be “DS”.
Quick question about getting up from the table when the true count drops to m1 or lower. Let’s say that after just 1 or 2 hands on a double deck table the count drops to m1, do I get up and leave? Or stick it out for a few more hands? What is the time limit on this?
I decided I am going to learn the art of card counting. I did spend 2 hours writing down the tutorial from my phone. Because I am to broke to get it printed. 5 Hours went into reading and reading more about the 0s, +’s, -‘s and all other crab who knows whos did blog. Then here and there food for the mind, which is helpful. But I love the honesty and the motivation in this article. There is hope, hope to buy a printer and hope for a girl like me to earn a extra income. Am going to glue myself to a deck of cards till I can get that 0. Then will I gamble and loose and then hopefully master the sience of 21 * 6 packed in a shoe. Count it from 0 to 0 and kick some boody.
Yeah but it then becomes really obvious that your card counting had the casino will kick you out. I wouldn’t bother, if it were really that easy, everyone would be doing it and the casinos will lose money.
I agree partially. I agree that no one should split tens, only because I feel bad for them on a personal level because they obviously don’t know how to play blackjack.
But I don’t agree with the notion that the 3rd baseman who plays “non-conventionally” screws up every other player. I’ve been playing blackjack for decades and have sat with these “bad” 3rd basemen. A lot of times other players would immediately leave the table because hey don’t want to play with that “idiot.”
I think that most players have selective memory. They tend to focus and remember the instances where the 3rd baseman’s stupid play cost them the hand. In reality, that “stupid” play oftens sets up the next “good” round (blackjack, winning splits, etc.). In other words, what goes around, comes around.
In closing, I feel that the everyday player should just stick with his best blackjack strategy and disregard other player’s deficiencies. If it is too intolerable, by all means, just move on.
KO and Hi-Lo are both getting you to the same information, just in slightly different ways. Hi-Lo is not more likely to give you a plus situation than KO.
(The one thing that Hi-Lo CAN do is give you an idea of how big your edge is in a particular spot, not just KO’s Yes-Or-No information. To get that extra info via Hi-Lo, you have to deal with the complexity of converting to a true count, which KO does not require.)
And for your other question, yes, you still need to account for all the unseen decks, even those behind the cut card.
I have now read all your classes and received your advanced strategy cards in the mail.
I seem to have discovered what appears to me an inconsistency in the variations.
For my double deck game (see comments above) advice on card for when I have a 12 against a 2 is to stay if the true count is at least 4. The card would on the other hand have me hit a 13 against that same 2 with the same true count of 4. How does that make sense, to hit the 13 but to stay with the 12 with the exact same circumstances?
To be clear, the card specifically says with my 12 to hit against the 2 as long as the TC is 3 or higher and with my 13 to stay as long as the TC is higher than -1 but that results in the above advice, right?
Thanks!
Perhaps you are being confused by the negative index number?
As you mention in your final paragraph, for a 2-deck H17 game the index for 12v2 is +3. The index for 13v2 is -1.
If the true count is +3 or higher, you should stand with 12v2.
If the true count is -1 or higher, you should stand with 13v2.
In your example, you ask about what happens at a true count of 4.
Since +4 is higher than both of the indexes (+3 and -1), you would stand with both 12v2 and 13v2. There is no inconsistency.
Yes, I seem to be confused as to the relationship between the index number and when you perform the alternative from basic strategy play. I latched on to this statement in your lessons.
“The general rule for understanding the Basic Strategy Variations Matrix is this: If the number in a slot is 0 or a minus, then that play is a Basic Strategy move that you should make as long as the count is higher than the number shown.”
So, 13 v2 with index -1 would mean play stay as long as count is higher than -1, like +4. What am I missing?
Of course it seems fundamental that I understand how to understand the index numbers so I will ask about the general rule above. When is that not the rule or is that always the rule? And what about when the index is positive, same general rule of playing basic strategy move as long as count is not higher than the index? Based upon what you said with 12 v 2 hitting until you get to at least +4 sounds like the answer is yes but it seems important to get this right.
Thanks!
Sorry, I confused myself. Let me restate my reply.
First of all, is it always the case that with an index of 0 or negative that you play basic strategy move only if the count is higher than the index, otherwise play the alternative?
Is it also the general rule that it works the opposite when the index is positive? In other words, you only play the basic strategy move if the count is equal or lower to the index? By general rule here do we also mean “always?”
Thanks!
Ah, I see the source of your confusion. The line you quoted from the GameMaster’s lesson is always correct when you are talking about the double or don’t double index numbers, but for hit/stand indexes it is only true for positive index numbers. That’s not helpful!
Since he makes the statement in a section where he is discussing soft hand doubling, I’m sure that’s what he was thinking about, but it sure is confusing. I’ll try to come up with a way to clarify it in the lesson. (I wish I could work with him on it, but his health situation must have worsened. See GameMaster.)
Despite his wording, index numbers should not be thought of as the point at which you change from basic strategy.
To see exactly what each group of index numbers does mean, see the section titled What are the different kinds of Index Numbers? near the bottom of the advanced card instructions page. Note that I don’t refer to basic strategy in that section, but instead simply explain what changes at the index number. That is a safer way of describing the meaning of index numbers, and doesn’t lead to the discrepancies that the GameMaster’s wording causes.
Thanks for the feedback. I need to figure out how to best clarify Lesson 23.
If you play a thousand hands, about how many will you surrender?
The advanced strategy chart I am using for double deck assumes surrender is an option but it is not in all the games I play. So, for 15 against a 10 where it says to surrender against a 10 or stand if TC is at least 4, I assume all I do is replace surrender with hit in this case and I am good, is that right? In other words just treat the surrenders as if they said hit but I still stand if the TC is at least as high as index.
Correct. When you cannot surrender just hit, unless the true count is at or higher than the hit/stand index number.
Your article. I freely admit that I hate bad players. I’ve gotten mad several times at players not playing the right way. The last time I played this guy hit on a 12 when the dealer showed a 6. I just can’t understand that play. Of course he busts with a face card and the dealer makes her hand with a lesser card. The dealer would have bust if he doesn’t hit. I am sorry, but I just can’t stand it. The guy cost the whole table by doing that and he did that a few other times as well. But maybe I should not get mad about that. It is hard to not get mad when you have a lot on a hand and this idiot just took the card that would have busted the dealer. I don’t know how to reconcile that.
Ken,
I’m playing 8 decks, H17 , DAS, Late Surrender , Peek , 75 % penetration.
I threw 200 boxes, 20 boxes a day.
80 % of the time I played alone, just me and the dealer , the other 20 % at the maximum with another player .
My bets are fixed : $ 5 in true negative score or = 2. I use also the top ten and leave the table when the true count is too low.
The result so far is an average US 495.25 a day, I’m making 4925.50 in total.
I’m lucky?
I am within the standard deviation ?
I can improve my bets ?
You have played a total of 200 hands and you’re up almost $5000, when betting $5 in bad counts and $50 at true +2 or higher?
That is almost impossible.
You ask if you have been lucky. Well, your expected win on 200 hands of this game is probably $10 or less. Does that answer your question? 🙂
By asking this question, it is clear that you have not read much about blackjack. Get yourself a decent book and understand it before you go back.
sorry , when the true count and more than 2 I bet $ 50 .
Has this been corrected? Or will all future orders still have this issue?
The cards have not yet been reprinted, and orders will include this error for at least the next few months.
Note that the error is only in the legend, not in the charts themselves. It is still clear what the correct strategy is for each decision.
Even in the legend, it is pretty easy to see that one of the “Double” instructions should be “DS”.
Quick question about getting up from the table when the true count drops to m1 or lower. Let’s say that after just 1 or 2 hands on a double deck table the count drops to m1, do I get up and leave? Or stick it out for a few more hands? What is the time limit on this?
well said!
I decided I am going to learn the art of card counting. I did spend 2 hours writing down the tutorial from my phone. Because I am to broke to get it printed. 5 Hours went into reading and reading more about the 0s, +’s, -‘s and all other crab who knows whos did blog. Then here and there food for the mind, which is helpful. But I love the honesty and the motivation in this article. There is hope, hope to buy a printer and hope for a girl like me to earn a extra income. Am going to glue myself to a deck of cards till I can get that 0. Then will I gamble and loose and then hopefully master the sience of 21 * 6 packed in a shoe. Count it from 0 to 0 and kick some boody.
Yeah but it then becomes really obvious that your card counting had the casino will kick you out. I wouldn’t bother, if it were really that easy, everyone would be doing it and the casinos will lose money.
I agree partially. I agree that no one should split tens, only because I feel bad for them on a personal level because they obviously don’t know how to play blackjack.
But I don’t agree with the notion that the 3rd baseman who plays “non-conventionally” screws up every other player. I’ve been playing blackjack for decades and have sat with these “bad” 3rd basemen. A lot of times other players would immediately leave the table because hey don’t want to play with that “idiot.”
I think that most players have selective memory. They tend to focus and remember the instances where the 3rd baseman’s stupid play cost them the hand. In reality, that “stupid” play oftens sets up the next “good” round (blackjack, winning splits, etc.). In other words, what goes around, comes around.
In closing, I feel that the everyday player should just stick with his best blackjack strategy and disregard other player’s deficiencies. If it is too intolerable, by all means, just move on.
KO and Hi-Lo are both getting you to the same information, just in slightly different ways. Hi-Lo is not more likely to give you a plus situation than KO.
(The one thing that Hi-Lo CAN do is give you an idea of how big your edge is in a particular spot, not just KO’s Yes-Or-No information. To get that extra info via Hi-Lo, you have to deal with the complexity of converting to a true count, which KO does not require.)
And for your other question, yes, you still need to account for all the unseen decks, even those behind the cut card.