Blackjack switch now in the UK

A

appletini_ian

New Member
It was a shoe game, looked like 6 decks, there was just 1 table.

They may also have bj switch in the Golden Nugget, last time I was there they had a table installed and were training the dealers how to play it, this was 2 or 3 weeks ago.
 
K

Kasi

Well-Known Member
newb99 said:
I play for the challenge not to earn an income, treat BJ and other table games as a form of entertainment and don't consider casinos to be ATMs.
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A man after my own heart lol.

Just curious, what are the exact rules of BJS in England? Or at least where you play?

Would the rules, whatever they are, be unchangeable throughout England or would the "Board" allow discretion to casinos to change the rules?

Assuming perfectish play lol, and, say, one rule set, or maybe the most popularly used rule-set, can someone say what the HA actually is more or less for a flat-betting BS player off the top?

Are they same, or very similar, to rule-sets in Vegas?

If I used the current EV's on the Wiz's site, which I think are different than the EV's he used to have for the Playtech game, are they different?, showed up with my 10,350 hand BS card, how much would it cost me by following it - I don't even care about his infinite deck assumptions vs 6 or x- decks in real life, etc?

How screwed would I be if I just used the old Playtech switch strategy to BJS in England despite whatever rule changes from that game are curently in effect?

Just looking for, basically, guesses, I guess lol.

From a BS point of view with -EV. So I can calculate the cost of my entertainment compared to some other game lol. In case I ever have to splurge on a Passport and end up in England. In which case, I could then go to Canada too in the near future.

A Passport to enter Canada. Go figure. Guess I'll just stop at Seneca Niagara, avoid the search and currency exchange issues and toll fee for the bridge. And get free drinks at Seneca Niagara too lol. Used to enjoy going there lol. Canada will survive just fine without me lol.
 
UK-21

UK-21

Well-Known Member
If you do a search for the UK Gambling Commission, you'll find their web site. Somewhere they will have a PDF download of the current rulesets of all table games approved in the UK. They are proscriptive, although there are some options available to licencees - ie lfor BJ icencees can choose whether they offer DD on any first two cards, or 9,10,11 only, choose whether to prohibit the splitting of 5s etc etc.

I haven't looked at this yet (don't play much or get down to the Smoke too often) but I would think the key to the switching strategy is to know what the advantageous and disadvantageous hands are - ie if you can switch a card to produce an initial 11 that's a good thing (especially in a pos count), if you switched a card to produce a 16, that'd be a bad thing. The WoO does say that the switching strategy should be largely obvious, although another important thing would be to know where the borderline is between +/- expectation hands, especially as a dealer 22 will push all. Then the BS to know when to stand, hit, double down etc, and the tricky bit will be to ascertain the indexes based on the 6 deck game (in the UK) - I suspect that, like in BJ, a few will generate the majority of the benefit (so it may not be as difficult to do as first thought - unless you want to take it to the nth degree).

All work in progress . . . .

:)
 
Automatic Monkey

Automatic Monkey

Banned
ExhibitCAA said:
No, Casino Royale no longer has a shoe game for BJ Switch, only CSMs.

SystemsTrader is correct that AS's strategy in BB of BJ is weak, and the claim that AS's WLPC system delivers a -0.25% game is not true, and is dangerous in the hands of APs, who might try blasting away at BJ Switch. I calculate that AS's strategy delivers around -1.2% for the rules he considers, which are hard to find anyway. And, no, AS does not do that on purpose; he does it because he is not a programmer and the BB of BJ is not written for professional players. Gotta give AS some props for being the first author to try to come up with something actually usable, as opposed to WoO's "strategy" of "add up the expectations of each pair of hands and select the better pair."

Geoff Hall isn't about to give you any useful information about his game. Over the years he has been a complete phony on these boards, pretending to be player-friendly or at least player-tolerant, without giving up ANY information that the player community doesn't already have.

WoO is your best starting point, but you should never take material out of context. WoO offers a fabulous website for the masses, but pros will generally require more accurate and detailed information.
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Sounds to me like your definition of a phony is someone who won't just hand you whatever you want. The fact that he designed the game and it treads the edge of a player advantage off the top proves he knows exactly what he's doing, and he's under no obligation to share his work with anyone. Switch wouldn't be the first BJ derivative to be heavily pounded by AP's before a book was written on it, and at the same time making money for the industry. We don't need the game designer to spoon-feed us his numbers. AP's make these games look good and it is smart business to encourage us to play and let us know it can be beaten without telling the whole world how to beat it. That's player-tolerant.

I wrote my own play strategy and if you need a switch strategy, why don't you just memorize the win rates of each possible hand like I did? Zen works fine. Not that I play BJ Switch that much, because it's hard to find in casinos, slow to play, and has somewhat high variance, much like some individuals.
 
K

Kasi

Well-Known Member
newb99 said:
... but I would think the key to the switching strategy is to know what the advantageous and disadvantageous hands are - ie if you can switch a card to produce an initial 11 that's a good thing (especially in a pos count),
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Well, I think you're right, maybe for the most part, maybe most of the switching decisions are obvious.

But, in the internet Playtech BJS game I know best, just as an eample, sometimes one would actually switch away from an initial BJ on one of your hands.

Playing a 4,7 & 3,4 would be a switch to 4,4 & 3,7 vs a dealer 7,8,9 and Ace.
Versus the 8,9 and Ace one has turned -EV into +EV.

So switching away from an 11 is sometimes good.

I could give examples of when switching to a 16 is a good thing. Like I'd switch from a 10,7 & 4,6 to a 10,6 & 4,7 vs dealer 8,10 and Ace etc lol. There's more. Like maybe I'd rather play a 16 and 14 vs 2 15's. vs dealer card 7. (9,6 & 8,7 vs 9,7 & 8,6).

Just examples. Nothing to do with counting. Only applying to the old Playtech game.

Depending on $mins and rules, rounds/hr/ etc it may be worth looking into for a BS player looking for entertainment value.

That's how I got into SP21 lol. Less -EV for my buck lol.
 
P

PumpkinEscobar

New Member
exhibitcaa said:
geoff hall: "you make me sound like i'm garnishing their trust in an evil plan to con them into losing money on the game."

aren't you?? I have heard that at night you sit on a throne cloaked in flames, with gargoyles and undead pit bosses at your feet, and the souls of thousands of onetime gamblers trapped in a bottle screaming. By now it should be obvious to everyone here that you are evil incarnate. Are you saying i heard wrong? I doubt that, because my sources are impeccable.
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rotflmao!
 
Katweezel

Katweezel

Well-Known Member
Rotf, wtf?...lol

newb99 said:
WTF does that mean ? ? ? ? ?

Translation please !
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As a stranger in a strange land, I too, had the same translation problems, Newb. Until I printed out the glossary of BJ terms on BJ21 FMB website. Thanks to Wong and Boot, I am up to speed with jargon, local lingo and decoding of certain key American phrases. Now I can ROTFLMAO. :cat:
 
Katweezel

Katweezel

Well-Known Member
Vivid word pictures

Originally Posted by exhibitcaa View Post
geoff hall: "you make me sound like i'm garnishing their trust in an evil plan to con them into losing money on the game."

EXCAA: "aren't you?? I have heard that at night you sit on a throne cloaked in flames, with gargoyles and undead pit bosses at your feet, and the souls of thousands of onetime gamblers trapped in a bottle screaming. By now it should be obvious to everyone here that you are evil incarnate. Are you saying i heard wrong? I doubt that, because my sources are impeccable."

These are truly imaginative and vividly creative word pictures there. You have the undead pitbosses there as well; but I would like them put in the bottle with the screaming trapped gambling souls, so they can be closer, to enjoy those screams for evermore. Can you arrange that ExhCAA?..

Sometimes, word pictures can liven up discussions that may have wandered off into the forest. (There's another! See?)
 
UK-21

UK-21

Well-Known Member
Katweezel said:
As a stranger in a strange land, I too, had the same translation problems, Newb. Until I printed out the glossary of BJ terms on BJ21 FMB website. Thanks to Wong and Boot, I am up to speed with jargon, local lingo and decoding of certain key American phrases. Now I can ROTFLMAO. :cat:
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Yes . . . well . . . we've known for a long time that our cousins on the other side of the pond have been doing a good job of corrupting the English language. I'll bear you in mind when I need a translator in the future.

As a sidenote, English-American translators do exist. Many years ago I did some work for a lady who had a job of re-writing perfectly good material that had been published in the UK (cook books if my memory serves me right) in such a way that it would be acceptable to the US markets. Apparently people in the States don't know what toad-in-the-hole is ???? :grin:
 
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