Yes I know of Andrew Scott, I don't know him personally though. I took mention of what you said and deleted the relevant information. Sorry if I appeared to have been questioning your motives, I understand where you're coming from. Do you suspect that pit staff from various casinos regularly check these forums?
Crown Casino Premier Blackjack
- Thread starter Koz1984
- Start date
Katweezel
Well-Known Member
Unspecific, undetailed... great!
I deleted some of mine too... I been reading stuff here since 11/08 and there are many posts in the archives here that confirm casino staff have regular spies that read everything posted daily on all US BJ sites. It's a given... Now if you were James P, what would you do? I know what I would do; exactly what casinos do in the US... keep up to date as much as possible with what the enemy is doing. Sound business practice, ain't it? (Dumb if you don't.)
Your preferred area is predominantly non-caucasian I guess... With only 5 tables, I think even Joe Goose could see that over time, the same 4 white dudes always seem to be in (relative) close proximity to each other. Just a thought... I'm sure you won't underestimate - nor overestimate - your casino benefactors. Cheers mate.
Well done Koz. It's nice and general now, and you're sweet...Koz1984 said:
I deleted some of mine too... I been reading stuff here since 11/08 and there are many posts in the archives here that confirm casino staff have regular spies that read everything posted daily on all US BJ sites. It's a given... Now if you were James P, what would you do? I know what I would do; exactly what casinos do in the US... keep up to date as much as possible with what the enemy is doing. Sound business practice, ain't it? (Dumb if you don't.)Your preferred area is predominantly non-caucasian I guess... With only 5 tables, I think even Joe Goose could see that over time, the same 4 white dudes always seem to be in (relative) close proximity to each other. Just a thought... I'm sure you won't underestimate - nor overestimate - your casino benefactors. Cheers mate.
Charles Wells
Member
Team play
Its a good plan. I would go in there with a decent bankroll ie 100,000.
As for investors, nobody is going to give you the time of day unless they know the manager personally and he has a track record of winning blackjack.
I considered playing in a team once until I gave all the prospects a hard test.
They failed miserably. I wouldnt have trusted them with 100 bucks let alone 100,000.
Be careful.
Its a good plan. I would go in there with a decent bankroll ie 100,000.
As for investors, nobody is going to give you the time of day unless they know the manager personally and he has a track record of winning blackjack.
I considered playing in a team once until I gave all the prospects a hard test.
They failed miserably. I wouldnt have trusted them with 100 bucks let alone 100,000.
Be careful.
Hey guys, I just had a question about deviations. We are incorporating deviations from BS into our play also, and was wondering if this chart was adequate:
http://www.blackjackapprenticeship.com/charts/BJA_T21_Hit17.pdf
I have used this site a bit for resources, and found this deviation table, however, it is slightly different to the illustrious 18. Does this difference matter significantly? What is the the general consensus for deviations?
http://www.blackjackapprenticeship.com/charts/BJA_T21_Hit17.pdf
I have used this site a bit for resources, and found this deviation table, however, it is slightly different to the illustrious 18. Does this difference matter significantly? What is the the general consensus for deviations?
21blackjackgirl
New Member
Hi! I'm not from Australia but recently traveld over there to play. I did play the private area one night since all the lower limit tables have horrible odds and continouas shuffle! My bankroll was no where near yours and k still walked out a few hundred up in a couple hours. Buy to answer your questions, you CAN double on any number. I did notice while I was there a group that seemed to be working together I may have been you. outré is one pit boss named michael seems the most strict so if ur on during his shift be careful. I've only been there four while I was in Melbourne but I noticed he was the only one that was intensly watching people when they changed and up there bets.
Come up with a good code between your team and you will be fine!
Come up with a good code between your team and you will be fine!
Thanks BlackJack girl. Yeah the good thing about that particular room is that they only have a supervisor there and a roaming pitboss. And a supervisor is nothing more than a glorified dealer who authorises cash exchanges above $500 and makes sure the rules are enforced.
The pit boss was never in the pit for more than a couple minutes at a time, and seemed too busy anyway to care about what was happening. I think we receive more heat from fellow players who glare at us and say things such as, "Geez great time to enter the shoe huh?" after we walk in with a hefty bet and land a natural.
Also, thanks Katz for reposting that for people to answer. I think it is pretty much exactly the same as the illustrious 18, with just a couple minor differences, unless I'm just reading it wrong?
The pit boss was never in the pit for more than a couple minutes at a time, and seemed too busy anyway to care about what was happening. I think we receive more heat from fellow players who glare at us and say things such as, "Geez great time to enter the shoe huh?" after we walk in with a hefty bet and land a natural.
Also, thanks Katz for reposting that for people to answer. I think it is pretty much exactly the same as the illustrious 18, with just a couple minor differences, unless I'm just reading it wrong?
RingyDingy
Well-Known Member
time i chimed in.
Ok, about time i chimed in i guess.
First thing is first,if you are white Caucasian, forget it, seriously FORGET IT.
Secondly do NOT under any circumstances use a crown club card, do not get sucked in by the freeby crap they throw your way. they will cross reference and profile you in no time.
I've even seen one of the reports where the analyse your play times at the same time as other players, and build a potential team profile.
Learn the shifts, there is several pit critters you need to avoid at all costs. these guys have a reputation and it is very well deserved.
Pick your play times correctly, pick the times you can A) Wong relatively easily, because this is one of your best tools. B) you can blend in. C) staff are tired and not concentrating.
Before you even step foot into the casino you need to get your act straight, your bankroll sorted, contracts drawn up, command structure in place, your signals 100% right and most importantly your counterheat plan.
Crown is going to give you heat, count on it 100%, it may not be immediately, but it will come, and we all know how many hours you have to put in to make this work.
Cheers
Ringy.
Ok, about time i chimed in i guess.
First thing is first,if you are white Caucasian, forget it, seriously FORGET IT.
Secondly do NOT under any circumstances use a crown club card, do not get sucked in by the freeby crap they throw your way. they will cross reference and profile you in no time.
I've even seen one of the reports where the analyse your play times at the same time as other players, and build a potential team profile.
Learn the shifts, there is several pit critters you need to avoid at all costs. these guys have a reputation and it is very well deserved.
Pick your play times correctly, pick the times you can A) Wong relatively easily, because this is one of your best tools. B) you can blend in. C) staff are tired and not concentrating.
Before you even step foot into the casino you need to get your act straight, your bankroll sorted, contracts drawn up, command structure in place, your signals 100% right and most importantly your counterheat plan.
Crown is going to give you heat, count on it 100%, it may not be immediately, but it will come, and we all know how many hours you have to put in to make this work.
Cheers
Ringy.
Charles Wells
Member
No heat at Crown
I agree with everything that RingyDingy said except the heat.
I have had no heat at Crown and this includes playing in pit27 which is an invitation only salon with 200 and 300 minimums on the BJ tables. There are suits and executives roaming making phone calls, taking notes and whatnot. Most AP players would look worried being amongst it.
The facts are:
200,000 buy in - no problem.
People coming over from Baccarat and changing pockets full of 25,000 plaques into 5,000 chips to play two boxes at 10,000 a hand - no problem
Winning a 100,000 in 5 minutes and walking away - no problem.
I have seen it all.
When I play 200 dollars a hand and wait ages for a mildly positive TC to raise my bet to 1000 the pit crew dont bat an eyelid.
The other players feel embarrassed that I am playing with black chips.
I agree with everything that RingyDingy said except the heat.
I have had no heat at Crown and this includes playing in pit27 which is an invitation only salon with 200 and 300 minimums on the BJ tables. There are suits and executives roaming making phone calls, taking notes and whatnot. Most AP players would look worried being amongst it.
The facts are:
200,000 buy in - no problem.
People coming over from Baccarat and changing pockets full of 25,000 plaques into 5,000 chips to play two boxes at 10,000 a hand - no problem
Winning a 100,000 in 5 minutes and walking away - no problem.
I have seen it all.
When I play 200 dollars a hand and wait ages for a mildly positive TC to raise my bet to 1000 the pit crew dont bat an eyelid.
The other players feel embarrassed that I am playing with black chips.
Ringy Dingy, I don't think I can agree with you entirely. To suggest they assume all white Caucasians are counters is a bit over the top. I will acknowledge that >80% of the players are Asian, however, I doubt they're suspecting of every Caucasian person. Either way, some good camouflage play can quietly dull suspicion too. Have an act, play some cheap perfect pair bets here and there. It isn't that difficult. The supervisors are too busy checking cash changed > $500 and making sure their high limit gamblers have drinks and are being treated well. The pit bosses don't even hang around, they simply walk in and out as they please checking up on things.
Charles, good to see you doing well. What is pit 27 by the way?
Charles, good to see you doing well. What is pit 27 by the way?
RingyDingy
Well-Known Member
I can only speak from my experience, read whatever into that you will.
Playing side bets such as PP etc dont cover much up, all they are doing is eating into your EV.
Remember this is a one casino town with employees that have worked all over the world and have seen it all, combined with paranoid management.
I'm not saying there is no opportunities, because there are, all im saying is get your ducks in a row, be as drilled in the many facets of your plan as you can be, and most of all keep your eyes wide open.
One side note, Crown about 4 years ago spent a lot of money on profiling is customers, in terms of the games they play and how they play them,a nd they realised very early on that the vast majority of thier BJ players knew some form of BS but no the whole picture, and those that did know BS stood out on certain key decision points in BS, you know Soft 17's and soft 18's etc.
these decision points are critical in basing the skill level of a player, crown knows this and uses this, because they know with the house edge they have, that unless counters play it perfectly they will still come out on top.
after all a casino loves a team or a counter who doesnt do it properly, thats as to them good as having a compulsive gambler in the place.
Playing side bets such as PP etc dont cover much up, all they are doing is eating into your EV.
Remember this is a one casino town with employees that have worked all over the world and have seen it all, combined with paranoid management.
I'm not saying there is no opportunities, because there are, all im saying is get your ducks in a row, be as drilled in the many facets of your plan as you can be, and most of all keep your eyes wide open.
One side note, Crown about 4 years ago spent a lot of money on profiling is customers, in terms of the games they play and how they play them,a nd they realised very early on that the vast majority of thier BJ players knew some form of BS but no the whole picture, and those that did know BS stood out on certain key decision points in BS, you know Soft 17's and soft 18's etc.
these decision points are critical in basing the skill level of a player, crown knows this and uses this, because they know with the house edge they have, that unless counters play it perfectly they will still come out on top.
after all a casino loves a team or a counter who doesnt do it properly, thats as to them good as having a compulsive gambler in the place.
RingyDingy
Well-Known Member
your cool there Charles, but from what i can see this discussion is not about a 200k bankrollCharles Wells said:
RingyDingy
Well-Known Member
PM incoming.
Charles Wells
Member
heat
I was just responding to the paranoia about heat.
They might have shitty rules, they might have CSM's, they might have been accused of playing against you with short decks with the tens removed but Crown gives no heat from what Ive seen.
You do whatever you want and there will be no response from the pit crew. The only person I have ever heard of being barred in 10 years is Andrew Scott. Most counters play there undisturbed.
The previous examples I gave would set alarm bells off in other US casinos and the players would be watched suspiciously. Not at crown.
I know half a dozen players personally who go there every week to play and they win consistently. They have never reported one incident of being harrased or ejected by management. Its non-existent.
Being barred for counting at Crown is something that should never worry you unless you go on national television and start making announcements or threaten the casino with court action.
Im saying this as a competent counter who has played in Australian casinos for over 20 years with no problems.
Im a caucasian who wears glasses and looks like a maths professor. I drink water and dont usually have cover plays. To any Vegas casino supervisior I would stand out as suspicious immediately yet at Crown no-one has ever bothered me.
PS.Pit 27 is a more private room within the Mahogany room through big glass doors to the left. Its min 25,000 to just enter the room.
Most of the table are Baccarat and everyone seems to be asian including the dealers. Im told you can see similar rooms in the Bellagio or larger Macau casinos.
I was just responding to the paranoia about heat.
They might have shitty rules, they might have CSM's, they might have been accused of playing against you with short decks with the tens removed but Crown gives no heat from what Ive seen.
You do whatever you want and there will be no response from the pit crew. The only person I have ever heard of being barred in 10 years is Andrew Scott. Most counters play there undisturbed.
The previous examples I gave would set alarm bells off in other US casinos and the players would be watched suspiciously. Not at crown.
I know half a dozen players personally who go there every week to play and they win consistently. They have never reported one incident of being harrased or ejected by management. Its non-existent.
Being barred for counting at Crown is something that should never worry you unless you go on national television and start making announcements or threaten the casino with court action.
Im saying this as a competent counter who has played in Australian casinos for over 20 years with no problems.
Im a caucasian who wears glasses and looks like a maths professor. I drink water and dont usually have cover plays. To any Vegas casino supervisior I would stand out as suspicious immediately yet at Crown no-one has ever bothered me.
PS.Pit 27 is a more private room within the Mahogany room through big glass doors to the left. Its min 25,000 to just enter the room.
Most of the table are Baccarat and everyone seems to be asian including the dealers. Im told you can see similar rooms in the Bellagio or larger Macau casinos.
This is the exact reason I am having trouble devising and implementing strategy. Some people say no heat, others say extreme heat. Some people say I can't beat Crown (even in the Maple room), some say its a beatable game. These conflicting ideas are very confusing to me!
Charles Wells
Member
no heat in high roller rooms
The heat you may have heard of could be just on the lower tables.
$30 min premium BJ attract a certain type of player with a certain type of BR.
In pit 27 the money is thrown around so freely that anything your average BJ player does is insignificant compared to what is going on around you.
I had never even seen 25K plaques before I went into this room. The mahogany room (main room) doesnt really have them. They only come about in the private rooms.
I am told there other private salons on level 29, Crystal Club? where even more serious action takes place.
Get a mahogany card and play at the higher limit table, I promise you wont get heat.
The heat you may have heard of could be just on the lower tables.
$30 min premium BJ attract a certain type of player with a certain type of BR.
In pit 27 the money is thrown around so freely that anything your average BJ player does is insignificant compared to what is going on around you.
I had never even seen 25K plaques before I went into this room. The mahogany room (main room) doesnt really have them. They only come about in the private rooms.
I am told there other private salons on level 29, Crystal Club? where even more serious action takes place.
Get a mahogany card and play at the higher limit table, I promise you wont get heat.