Deck cuts

[Whatsmytotal]

I don't know if this has been posted anywhere else....How do the current rules used by the casinos (eg deck cutting) affect card counting accuracy?

 

[Sonny]

How do the current rules used by the casinos (eg deck cutting) affect card counting accuracy?

I don't understand what you mean by "deck cutting." Do you mean the players cutting the deck or the dealer cutting off part of the shoe?

-Sonny-

 

[killerbot848]

i think hes talking about the dealer cutting off part of the shoe

 

[ScottH]

If you're talking about a player cutting the deck, then it has no effect on a counting cards. If you mean the dealer cutting off part of the deck with the cut card, or penetration, then it has a huge effect on card counting.

 

[Whatsmytotal]

I mean the dealer cutting out a portion of the decks. Does this negate the edge gained by card counting?

 

[Mikeaber]

I mean the dealer cutting out a portion of the decks. Does this negate the edge gained by card counting?

It IS a factor for sure; a huge factor. The more the dealer cuts off, the worse it is for the Advantage Player.

 

[Sonny]

I mean the dealer cutting out a portion of the decks. Does this negate the edge gained by card counting?

It doesn't negate the advantage, but it can either reduce it or increase it dramatically. As Scott and Mike mentioned, it is the most important factor of the game.

-Sonny-

 

[Whatsmytotal]

So despite the house cutting out portions of decks, should the counting methods be applied the same way as if the complete decks were being used?

 

[Mikeaber]

So despite the house cutting out portions of decks, should the counting methods be applied the same way as if the complete decks were being used?

There are only two strategies I've seen that deal with the percentage of cut. The first is don't play if it it really bad. The second is that betting spreads must be increased on poorer cuts to make up the lost advantage from the cut. But, counting strategy and playing strategy is not impacted.

"Don't Play" cut points I use are
6-deck 75% or better
2-deck 60% or better
1-deck 50% or better

 

[Automatic Monkey]

There are only two strategies I've seen that deal with the percentage of cut. The first is don't play if it it really bad. The second is that betting spreads must be increased on poorer cuts to make up the lost advantage from the cut. But, counting strategy and playing strategy is not impacted..

Can't say I agree with that totally. Your bet should be proportional to your advantage, and your advantage is a function of the count. So if you increase your bet for any reason other than the count, you are overbetting. There's really no way to compensate for bad pen when you are counting. You just make less money.

 

[Mikeaber]

Can't say I agree with that totally. Your bet should be proportional to your advantage, and your advantage is a function of the count. So if you increase your bet for any reason other than the count, you are overbetting. There's really no way to compensate for bad pen when you are counting. You just make less money.

You'll get no defense from me on that statement AM. I do not know from personal knowledge, just from what I've read. I do know that I tend to steer away from poor pen games. Like this past weekend. Played one shoe for that was enough to "discover" a 6-deck shoe had over 2 decks cut off. I backcounted that table and would have lost my butt had I followed the count and raised bets...assumming of course that I had been playing (which I wasn't!). On the other hand, I lost my butt playing 6-deck with fantastic cuts at another casino :flame: Can't wait to get back there and seek revenge :laugh:

 

[Whatsmytotal]

How can you tell how many decks the casino is excising?

 

[zengrifter]

If you can't simply look at the stack and tell, you can ask the dealer. zg

 

[zengrifter]

Originally Posted by Mikeaber
...betting spreads must be increased on poorer cuts to make up the lost advantage from the cut. ..​

Can't say I agree with that totally. Your bet should be proportional to your advantage, and your advantage is a function of the count. So if you increase your bet for any reason other than the count, you are overbetting. There's really no way to compensate for bad pen when you are counting. You just make less money.

Mike said it almost correctly - should have said "lost FREQUENCY of advantage" - which IS overcome with a bigger spread - not necessarily a bigger topBet. zg