How to Handle AC heat?

[WABJ11]

I was getting extremely lucky last week at the Hilton, and with the sizable roll i had accumulated in the span of a few hours I thought I'd give the 6 deck game S17 a shot. I was doing pretty well using the red seven count. Suddenly a guy in a suit comes over to me and introduces himself. He tells me that he's going to be straight up with me and the dealer is going to cut half the shoe and they will shuffle every time I raise my bet.

I honestly am not that advanced on shoe games, but I was up so much getting lucky that I think they gave me more credit than I deserved. Anyway, after I color up he comes over to me and tells me they have my picture and will send it out to all the AC casinos and I will never be able to play BJ in AC again, unless I stop playing at the Hilton and stay out of their hair.

What's the proper thing to do in this situation? Should I give them a hard time and tie up one of their $25 min 6 deck tables? Should I just leave? I was tempted to screw with them but I wasn't sure how.

 

[aslan]

I was getting extremely lucky last week at the Hilton, and with the sizable roll i had accumulated in the span of a few hours I thought I'd give the 6 deck game S17 a shot. I was doing pretty well using the red seven count. Suddenly a guy in a suit comes over to me and introduces himself. He tells me that he's going to be straight up with me and the dealer is going to cut half the shoe and they will shuffle every time I raise my bet.

I honestly am not that advanced on shoe games, but I was up so much getting lucky that I think they gave me more credit than I deserved. Anyway, after I color up he comes over to me and tells me they have my picture and will send it out to all the AC casinos and I will never be able to play BJ in AC again, unless I stop playing at the Hilton and stay out of their hair.

What's the proper thing to do in this situation? Should I give them a hard time and tie up one of their $25 min 6 deck tables? Should I just leave? I was tempted to screw with them but I wasn't sure how.

It sounds like he had you dead to rights on the counting part. The threat about sending your picture around to all the casinos, I don't know--i never heard of that before. I doubt that AC casinos are that organized between all the different companies operating there. I know from experience that casinos will send pictures and data to all their affiliates, but all casinos--that's a new one on me unless some new Griffin type book has begun.

Other people on the forum have been ID'ed in AC and nothing like that happened. Who is Hilton affiliated with anyway? Do you know?

Like you I wouldn't put up a fuss. Why make them want to do anything to you if they have a chance? You might be able to return there and not be recognized, especially on different shifts, but using your player's card is now out of the question.

 

[moo321]

I've heard the Hilton is pretty sharp...

 

[Thunder]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The Hilton 2 deck game is a counter trap. I do like one of their pit bosses though. Very nice person.

 

[moo321]

I've said it before and I'll say it again. The Hilton 2 deck game is a counter trap. I do like one of their pit bosses though. Very nice person.

Wait, that two deck game is actually going?

 

[WABJ11]

Wait, that two deck game is actually going?

That two deck game is a joke. Your lucky to get 50% pen, they let you spread whatever you want and the pit doesn't blink an eye.

 

[21forme]

Are you a local who intends to return to AC? If so, just leave. If not, have some fun

There is some faxing going on between casinos. About 5 years ago, I got the 5-50 placard pulled out for me in the HL pit at Harrahs Marina from info that came from Borgata, no question about it.

 

[aslan]

Are you a local who intends to return to AC? If so, just leave. If not, have some fun

There is some faxing going on between casinos. About 5 years ago, I got the 5-50 placard pulled out for me in the HL pit at Harrahs Marina from info that came from Borgata, no question about it.

That is informative. Every AC player should hear it.

Once ID'ed, I would park the player's cards for all casinos, if not sooner. BTW, is there any evidence that photos are shared?

 

[ChefJJ]

Other people on the forum have been ID'ed in AC and nothing like that happened. Who is Hilton affiliated with anyway? Do you know?

Resorts, I believe.

 

[21forme]

That is informative. Every AC player should hear it.

Once ID'ed, I would park the player's cards for all casinos, if not sooner. BTW, is there any evidence that photos are shared?

In my case, the PC jumped to the phone after he swiped my card, so something was entered in their system by someone and it wasn't a picture ID.

 

[Bojack1]

I was in town this weekend for the Kelly Pavlik Sergio Martinez fight, and I did get a fair amount of play in as well. I must say that the original post in this thread sounds a bit fishy. I guess anything could happen, I of course don't know it all, but this kind of confrontation in AC would be a first of its kind as far as my experience, and of those I know who have played there.

Not to say you can't experience heat, but in the manner in which the personnel handled it was extremely out of character. I have associates with arm long banning rap sheets playing large stakes that have never been approached in this manner. I myself have frequented the casino mentioned here for many years and have not seen such an action. Yes I believe they will share info, but not with those they are tracking. It makes no sense to allow the counter to be able to prepare a defense against casino counter measures. The best way to deter a counter is to instill paranoia through the unknown. How many ap's come on this very website every week freaking out about supposed heat? Too many actually. I think if a worried counter knew he had heat he could handle it better than those that just assume they do. I see that all the time. I won't go into this further, but I think there is something amiss in this post. I will not call it a lie, it may be true, I was not at the incident to refute it as fact. I would say in my opinion, that it seems highly unlikely.

And as an answer to the original thread question, how to handle AC heat, play unrated and move around alot. AC doesn't offer the best games to straight counters, but its one of the easiest to handle heat wise. An incident happening as described originally in the first post, would mean gross mishandling of the playing situation by the counter more than it being sharp surveillence by the casino. For all its tough games to play, AC still is an easy beat with aggressive on the move play. Getting huge heat in AC usually means your game is flawed.

 

[kewljason]

I too thought the original comments seemed, well, I don't want to say 'fishy', but certainly out of character and something I have never heard of. Although I have played a great deal in AC over the past 6 years, all but the last couple years where at a level that probably didn't concern too many people and I have attracted minimal heat, so I didn't want to comment. Figured I would see what some of the other AC regs thought of it and none better than Mr Bojack to comment. Even now my max bet is at a level (below the $500 threshold) that I still don't draw much heat. I have always played the hit and style that Bojack speaks of though. Rarely do I play at one table more than 30 minutes (2 shoes) and often if the count tanks I am walking within a few minutes. Playing this style and unrated makes it difficult to attract heat unless you are really overplaying a venue.

 

[aslan]

I have played some pretty wild games with some pretty wild spreads in AC. I have "felt" heat but never been approached. When I have spread really big I didn't stick around for another shoe in the same pit on the same shift. Compared to Vegas, I feel AC is pretty tame. You can get backed off in Vegas for small spreads in low limit games; that has never happened to me in AC. But you never know. A new PC fresh out of training who thinks he's hot s###, and you have the ingredients for a bad scene. But the places I play, that PC wouldn't last long.

 

[WABJ11]

I was in town this weekend for the Kelly Pavlik Sergio Martinez fight, and I did get a fair amount of play in as well. I must say that the original post in this thread sounds a bit fishy. I guess anything could happen, I of course don't know it all, but this kind of confrontation in AC would be a first of its kind as far as my experience, and of those I know who have played there.

Not to say you can't experience heat, but in the manner in which the personnel handled it was extremely out of character. I have associates with arm long banning rap sheets playing large stakes that have never been approached in this manner. I myself have frequented the casino mentioned here for many years and have not seen such an action. Yes I believe they will share info, but not with those they are tracking. It makes no sense to allow the counter to be able to prepare a defense against casino counter measures. The best way to deter a counter is to instill paranoia through the unknown. How many ap's come on this very website every week freaking out about supposed heat? Too many actually. I think if a worried counter knew he had heat he could handle it better than those that just assume they do. I see that all the time. I won't go into this further, but I think there is something amiss in this post. I will not call it a lie, it may be true, I was not at the incident to refute it as fact. I would say in my opinion, that it seems highly unlikely.

And as an answer to the original thread question, how to handle AC heat, play unrated and move around alot. AC doesn't offer the best games to straight counters, but its one of the easiest to handle heat wise. An incident happening as described originally in the first post, would mean gross mishandling of the playing situation by the counter more than it being sharp surveillence by the casino. For all its tough games to play, AC still is an easy beat with aggressive on the move play. Getting huge heat in AC usually means your game is flawed.

Everything I reported was true. I was up almost 5k which at the Hilton midweek alone, counting or not, would draw a lot of attention. He never said the comment to me about posting my pictures around town until I inquired to him what he would do if I was playing with other patrons in a shoe. Until then I had the table to myself since it was early morning. I am also pretty young so I would assume they would think they could intimidate me; could have just been false threats trying to get me to leave.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

Everything I reported was true. I was up almost 5k which at the Hilton midweek alone, counting or not, would draw a lot of attention. He never said the comment to me about posting my pictures around town until I inquired to him what he would do if I was playing with other patrons in a shoe. Until then I had the table to myself since it was early morning. I am also pretty young so I would assume they would think they could intimidate me; could have just been false threats trying to get me to leave.

Yes, I suspect your youth may have made them think they had license to jerk you around a little.

Hilton is a dysfunctional, paranoid facility that appears to believe they can blame their failures not on their horrible management and facility, but on the 0.1% of their blackjack players who play with a 1% advantage. Keep in mind who the pit boss is and avoid him. Go back when you feel like it, bounce around the pits, don't stay more than an hour or two.

 

[aslan]

Yes, I suspect your youth may have made them think they had license to jerk you around a little.

You took the words right out of my mouth. Some PCs don't consider young players to be legitimate customers unless they're wearing a tie or other symbol of "worthiness."

 

[WABJ11]

Yes, I suspect your youth may have made them think they had license to jerk you around a little.

Hilton is a dysfunctional, paranoid facility that appears to believe they can blame their failures not on their horrible management and facility, but on the 0.1% of their blackjack players who play with a 1% advantage. Keep in mind who the pit boss is and avoid him. Go back when you feel like it, bounce around the pits, don't stay more than an hour or two.

Wasn't even a pit boss, it was the "shift manager" as he introduced himself.

 

[kewljason]

You took the words right out of my mouth. Some PCs don't consider young players to be legitimate customers unless they're wearing a tie or other symbol of "worthiness."

I haven't found that to be the case. I am still in my 20's and most PC's treat me no different than any other customer. (and I don't own a tie ) I give them no reason not to. I try to respectful, polite and friendly to them as well as the other customers. That is actually my attitude towards anyone in life.

Some of you guys seem to paint PC's with a broad brush as bad people. The enemy. Most are just people doing a job. And most are not all that fanatical about it. They just want to get through the day and get home and barbeque, play with kids, play fantasy football, go to the bar or whatever it is that they do on there own time. Of course, like everything else in life there are a few 'bad apples' who want to use their 'position' to just be a jackass.

Getting back to the original point though. There are many places, like Borgata in AC and Hard Rock in vegas, among others, that go out of their way to cater to the young crowd in their 20's and 30's. This group is often veiwed as having disposable income.

 

[aslan]

I haven't found that to be the case. I am still in my 20's and most PC's treat me no different than any other customer. (and I don't own a tie ) ....Some of you guys seem to paint PC's with a broad brush as bad people. The enemy.

"Some" PCs....

 

[Automatic Monkey]

I haven't found that to be the case. I am still in my 20's and most PC's treat me no different than any other customer. (and I don't own a tie ) I give them no reason not to. I try to respectful, polite and friendly to them as well as the other customers. That is actually my attitude towards anyone in life.

Some of you guys seem to paint PC's with a broad brush as bad people. The enemy. Most are just people doing a job. And most are not all that fanatical about it. They just want to get through the day and get home and barbeque, play with kids, play fantasy football, go to the bar or whatever it is that they do on there own time. Of course, like everything else in life there are a few 'bad apples' who want to use their 'position' to just be a jackass.

Getting back to the original point though. There are many places, like Borgata in AC and Hard Rock in vegas, among others, that go out of their way to cater to the young crowd in their 20's and 30's. This group is often veiwed as having disposable income.

And on the other hand, the Hilton probably has the oldest clientele. Hilton is a brand respected by the 60+ crowd, as Hard Rock is by people in their 30's.

In general though (and as you will see as you get older) age does bring about a level of intimidation/respect from authority figures because of a general understanding that certain transgressions will not be gotten away with. We get a lot more slack from police and judges, as opposed to the caricature of the "smartass kid" whom those in authority sometimes get a kick out of picking on.