Question on ratholing

peaegg

peaegg

Well-Known Member
I agree

aslan said:
In truth, I have never come close to always looking like a loser because it is most difficult to hide winnings when they come at the end of a shoe just before you color up.

I think most Christmas chippers (red and green) find it pretty easy to stay under the radar, at least at the larger casinos, but at the black level and above, I would take nothing for granted. That's just me. You may differ.
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Don't get me wrong, I rathole all the time. I have posted strategies about how to in the past. As matter of fact, I ratholed 8 blacks today at a $50 table. I can't give you anymore details about how I did it. May be some other time.
 
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paddywhack

Well-Known Member
peaegg said:
As matter of fact, I ratholed 8 blacks today at a $50 table. I can't give you anymore details about how I did it. May be some other time.
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Excellent - but you need certain circumstances to exist if you want to guarantee that they aren't credited to your account anyway. You may well have taken them off the table without the pit knowing. But the pit "did" credit them to someone when they tallied up the chip tray. If it was you they credited them to, then all you got away with was having them wonder why you stuck them in your pocket.
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
peaegg said:
Don't get me wrong, I rathole all the time. I have posted strategies about how to in the past. As matter of fact, I ratholed 8 blacks today at a $50 table. I can't give you anymore details about how I did it. May be some other time.
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No, I realize what you were saying and I agree.

And you are right not to share such details in a public Forum. And it can be done successfully even with the carefully tracked blacks under the right circumstances.
 
S

SBT

Member
I am new at playing. But when I start to win during a playing session, I do put chips in my purse or jacket pocket. I don't try to hide this activity. From reading this thread, I guess I should try to be a little more secretive. I pocket them for a couple of reasons, one of which is that I like to keep my "buy-in" amount separate from my wins. I don't want to leave the casino in the hole, and this is my little accounting technique. I am playing small potatoes, only buying in for $60-100 and playing $5 or $10 minimum tables. I usually leave the casino when I have made close to double what I bought in for -- mostly red chips, sometimes greens. I have consistently won at our local little casino. I hope that I am not on their radar at this low of a level, though.
 
B

Baberuth

Well-Known Member
Ratholers Beware

After reading excellent replies from Aslan and Paddywhack's take on ratholing blacks any further information is probably too much. The only APs who need to rathole are consistent winners at a frequented store. That narrows it down to a small number. Then you have to be careful about the denomination of the chips you rathole. If not black, that it shouldn't be a big deal. Should you get caught, you better have a take on why you are doing it and it better go with your overall cover.
Thanks Paddywhack and Aslan for excellent informative replies.

Babe
 
kewljason

kewljason

Well-Known Member
Baberuth said:
After reading excellent replies from Aslan and Paddywhack's take on ratholing blacks any further information is probably too much. The only APs who need to rathole are consistent winners at a frequented store. That narrows it down to a small number. Then you have to be careful about the denomination of the chips you rathole. If not black, that it shouldn't be a big deal. Should you get caught, you better have a take on why you are doing it and it better go with your overall cover.
Thanks Paddywhack and Aslan for excellent informative replies.

Babe
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"Getting caught", won't require you to have any explanation. It isn't illegal. But it will raise suspicion, most likely without you even knowing about it, which would be a huge negative far outweighing the benefits of rat-holing.

I have an acquaintance who works in the pit of one of the larger strip casinos that has told me that he can spot a counter simply by observing several actions and moves that are common to counters. Removing money from the table is on that list of 6 things. So while rat-holing by itself proves nothing, coupled with a couple other moves/plays will raise suspicion and do more harm than good. On the occasions that I do so, I only do so off the casino floor, away from the prying 'eye'.
 
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paddywhack

Well-Known Member
kewljason said:
I have an acquaintance who works in the pit of one of the larger strip casinos that has told me that he can spot a counter simply by observing several actions and moves that are common to counters. Removing money from the table is on that list of 6 things. So while rat-holing by itself proves nothing, coupled with a couple other moves/plays will raise suspicion and do more harm than good. On the occasions that I do so, I only do so off the casino floor, away from the prying 'eye'.
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To those that infrequently played rated, rat holing is not usually needed. Playing a store that has all your info and has known you for years - you have no choice but to try and fool them as much as you can.
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
paddywhack said:
To those that infrequently played rated, rat holing is not usually needed. Playing a store that has all your info and has known you for years - you have no choice but to try and fool them as much as you can.
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But I'm sure you'd agree that if you play unrated and frequent the same stores, you don't have to play rated, and they don't need to know your name, for the casino to keep a record on you. It's always better to overestimate the need for rat-holing. In accounting we say, it's better to err on the side of conservatism.
 
M

maddencutter

Member
kewljason said:
"Getting caught", won't require you to have any explanation. It isn't illegal. But it will raise suspicion, most likely without you even knowing about it, which would be a huge negative far outweighing the benefits of rat-holing.

I have an acquaintance who works in the pit of one of the larger strip casinos that has told me that he can spot a counter simply by observing several actions and moves that are common to counters. Removing money from the table is on that list of 6 things. So while rat-holing by itself proves nothing, coupled with a couple other moves/plays will raise suspicion and do more harm than good. On the occasions that I do so, I only do so off the casino floor, away from the prying 'eye'.
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The other five?

Come on...;)
 
blackjack avenger

blackjack avenger

Well-Known Member
terminology matters

With the whole AP = criminal uproar should we really use the term ratholing? Why not pocketing chips? Maybe going/heading south? or something else?

I know refer to wonging as robbery or murder?
 
aslan

aslan

Well-Known Member
blackjack avenger said:
With the whole AP = criminal uproar should we really use the term ratholing? Why not pocketing chips? Maybe going/heading south? or something else?

I know refer to wonging as robbery or murder?
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Taking the green line to South Carolina

Hopping the purple line downtown

Shipping a package to Johannesburg

Pocketing a parcel

Opening a bank account in Lower Manhattan

Escaping south of the border with the cash

Turning dollars into pesos

Scratch-in' my crotch

Cheque-ing for crabs

Getting a bulge in my pocket

Spreading the wealth

Canning pickles

Starting a stash

Chipping away

Putting something in the vault for safe keeping

Deep sea diving

Deep sixing the cash

Going down to Dixie

Basement storage project

Submarining

or my favorite,

Secretly concealing chips from the pit boss. :rolleyes:
 
T

tthree

Banned
aslan said:
Taking the green line to South Carolina

Hopping the purple line downtown

Shipping a package to Johannesburg

Pocketing a parcel

Opening a bank account in Lower Manhattan

Escaping south of the border with the cash

Turning dollars into pesos

Scratch-in' my crotch

Cheque-ing for crabs

Getting a bulge in my pocket

Spreading the wealth

Canning pickles

Starting a stash

Chipping away

Putting something in the vault for safe keeping

Deep sea diving

Deep sixing the cash

Going down to Dixie

Basement storage project

Submarining

or my favorite,

Secretly concealing chips from the pit boss. :rolleyes:
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I like chipping away.
 
P

paddywhack

Well-Known Member
aslan said:
But I'm sure you'd agree that if you play unrated and frequent the same stores, you don't have to play rated, and they don't need to know your name, for the casino to keep a record on you. It's always better to overestimate the need for rat-holing. In accounting we say, it's better to err on the side of conservatism.
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Totally agree. Always err on the side of caution when hitting a store on a fairly frequent basis.
 
Dyepaintball12

Dyepaintball12

Well-Known Member
I've played at tons of tables where ploppies rathole. Hell one time a guy who was doing it a lot actually assisted me in doing so...

I was pocketing greens and over several hours I had maybe $800 in greens in my pocket. I go to cash out what's on the table and the PB goes "You played 5 hours and broke even... not bad!"

The Asian lady next to me at this point starts (in broken english) saying "what about the greens in your pocket?" and pointing at it.

The guy at the other end of the table goes "Nope that's all the chips he has. Nice job man." and kept basically talking over her until she gave up :)

I threw a tip down on the table and start walking away and the PB says "What a nice young man." :laugh:
 
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