Side Counts in 6D and 8D

[zengrifter]

With basic ASC, you will get 25% or 30% more return than using Zen.

Thats a not uncommon delusion.

What is "advanced ASC" ? zg

 

[ARK]

Its not ideal for either game. zg

I'm basically stuck with shoe games in my area so currently using the Zen Count. What do you think about side counts for shoe games? Worthwhile or not enough return?

 

[tthree]

I'm basically stuck with shoe games in my area so currently using the Zen Count. What do you think about side counts for shoe games? Worthwhile or not enough return?

In pitch games the player gets about 2/3rd of his advantage from playing efficiency and 1/3rd from betting correlation while in shoe games the player advantage comes 2/3rd from betting correlation and 1/3rd from playing efficiency. Another factor is your advantage is slightly larger at the same TC with fewer decks remaining to be played. These factors make pitch games much more profitable for a side count. Add in the factors many have been mentioning as well as the superior discipline one must demand of oneself to accurately side count a shoe most don't think it is worth it. I think the higher your risk of ruin the more important this gain becomes. If you get extreme densities in either direction of your side counted card(s) and get the affected hand matchups, the added information can mean a lot to you. I actually count more accurately with one side count but it slows me down some. I think the added focus is why I am more accurate. If you are not slowing the game down don't even worry about your speed. I often have to play crowded tables so my speed usually has no affect on the speed of the game. I am fast enough to be ready when the dealer gets to me.

 

[johnnyb]

I'm basically stuck with shoe games in my area so currently using the Zen Count. What do you think about side counts for shoe games? Worthwhile or not enough return?

If you are willing to give up minor amounts of brainpower for an added advantage, then why not? Just depends if you're a casual player or you plan on being a professional. If you're just casual, then I wouldn't think it would be necessary. Casual players are just there for the short run, and sometimes a 2%-3% addition can't always be seen in the short run. However, if you are or will be a professional, and you plan on being there for the long run, then squeezing every penny out of each hand might be on your agenda.

Choose what your gamestyle is going to be.

 

[blackjack avenger]

a comparison

Halves outperformed hi op II A side count
Both full indices
Wonging 1 to 4
4.5/6 h 17 das

Full indices should favor hi op II
The limited spread should hurt halves

The more negative hands you play the stronger hi op, the more you Wong the stronger halves.

One can get high performance; halves, without any side count.

The above did not consider other side counts.

 

[kewljason]

Without ASC, Omega II is only marginally better than Zen. With basic ASC, you will get 25% or 30% more return than using Zen. With advanced ASC, Omega II will double your return than using Zen.

Double return of count over another??

30% increase??

Where are you getting these numbers from?

Contradicts everything I have ever read and sim results.

We can have these discussions about the differences and improved results with different level counts with or without side counts as long as data is some what factual. Many players seem to like to "cherry-pick" a situation, game or set of rules to use as an example to support their claims about these thing which are often overexaggerated and just don't translate that way in the real world, but you seem to just pull numbers and facts out of the air.