What is a ploppy? Let alone other terms

[ChefJJ]

pit15,

Noting that you've "only been playing for a few months", I'm not really sure why you exclude recreational APs from real APs. Perhaps it's only semantics, but you may find that many practitioners of the wide array of AP arts are in it for the supplemental income and/or the sheer challenge...and, of course, they are real.

Proper bankroll, lifestyle, back-offs, health insurance (typical benefits), and the like are some of the reasons why a rec AP may not choose it for his/her FT job. I say this not to defend anyone in particular (including myself); merely my perspective on things.

best of luck :joker:

 

[who345]

I always thought

ploppy === not AP
AP === not ploppy

AP + ploppy = 100%


if not, what is (100% - AP - ploppy)?

 

[BJLFS]

I always thought

ploppy === not AP
AP === not ploppy

AP + ploppy = 100%


if not, what is (100% - AP - ploppy)?

Yeah but what's the eigenvalue?

 

[Jyn8923]

Well goodevening gents I have to say after reading the new posts I'd like to declare myself a non ploppy because I do play bj on my iPhone every given moment of free time which tracks my plays and stats. Now that been established I would like to profess that my basic strategy is not as has been described, nor do I claim to have read every book etc. I am an average bj player at this moment, but do not hold myself to the screw ups of basic strategy as has been described. Much appreciate the feedback and the comedic gestures. Do have a good night I'm officially drunk at this party on my iPhone as my British accent is coming out heavily lol. Always in good fun mates

 

[aslan]

professional APs?

I'd say 100000:1

1000:1 sounds right, but 99% of "APs" are wannabes, or are spreading nickels recreationally and pose no threat.

I know a guy who thinks he's a counter, but has the following problems:
- No bankroll, he doesn't bet very big and even then is overbetting what he has
- Loses the count
- I only watched him play for a short while, but corrected him twice on basic strategy plays (both on how to handle soft 18 -- typical ploppy misplays). Now I don't even play blackjack much and I know BS cold.

I've seen hole carders who are sloppy and make errors as well in games with very little tolerance for mistake.

If you play every weekend for years and never get backed off / barred, chances are you're not a real AP. If you're doing it for fun and betting small, nobody cares. If you're a real AP you will have a win rate that poses a threat, and you will be playing often enough where you WILL run into someone who will back you off. Every real AP I've spoken to (and where I've witnessed their play and determined they are a profitable player) has been backed off/barred numerous times.

I only been playing for a few months and I been backed off a couple times already. Once was because of my own stupidity, the other was because of betting/winning at a level that made them sweat (and intending to play the entire shift), and they got really hostile about it.

I would use the following criteria to say whether or not someone is a "real AP":
- Bankrolled well enough to have a ROR < 5%
- Does not play negative expectation games, regardless of reason or BS excuse
- Has a win rate high enough where they will not be tolerated by any casino once their play is made (Does not mean they need to win enough to cause attention at some of the higher end places. By this I mean they'll get tossed out / backed off if the pit already knows what they're doing.). This also covers all other aspects such as discipline. If you're not disciplined then your win rate will be negative.

For a recreational AP:
- Does not play, or plays a VERY limited amount of negative expectation games
- All their play combined against the house has a net positive expectation

I'm glad you added that last part. For a while I thought you were saying if a player did not play extremely well, they should be considered a ploppy. Not everyone who has a low win rate or makes little money is inept--ie, a ploppy. An AP may not be willing to dedicate sufficient bankroll to support a full betting spread; he may already have sufficient income and be happy to breakeven or barely stay on the winning side; he may be happy with the comps and a few extra dollars; he may not need the money and wants to avoid the extreme roller coaster rides that come with large betting spreads; he may be more interested in the social aspects of the game, than making money; he may have a full time job and cannot put the hours into AP to make a significant amount of money; for other reasons, he may not have the time to play or be willing to put in the necessary hours. In all these he has the skills to maximize his win rate or to win more money, but for the stated reasons, he intentionally settles for less.

Whatever floats your boat. I like the fact that you characterize them as recreational APs. They don't make their living or a significant amount of money at AP, but they are nevertheless bone fide APs. The ploppies are losers; the APs are winners, even if some of their gains are in comps, social aspects, challenge and entertainment. So long as they stay out of the loser bracket, it's AP.

 

[aslan]

Yeah but what's the eigenvalue?

Who has time to do an eigenploppy analysis?

 

[moo321]

I've seen a lot of guys that think they're sharp that are actually ploppies... Even saw some well respected forum members at a meetup that made BS mistakes. Bad mistakes.

 

[aslan]

I've seen a lot of guys that think they're sharp that are actually ploppies... Even saw some well respected forum members at a meetup that made BS mistakes. Bad mistakes.

Maybe they were deliberate "cover" mistakes. Or like me, maybe they only play a limited number of index plays--but you said BS, didn't you? Hmmm! That is inexplicable.

 

[moo321]

Maybe they were deliberate "cover" mistakes. Or like me, maybe they only play a limited number of index plays--but you said BS, didn't you? Hmmm! That is inexplicable.

No, there was definitely no heat. Stuff like not doubling a7 v. a bust card...

 

[aslan]

No, there was definitely no heat. Stuff like not doubling a7 v. a bust card...

Who knows--maybe he had a side count of 2s and 3s. :laugh: Just trying to put a good construction on what my fellow colleagues may have done.

 

[Albee]

Red Chipper

As a recreational red chipper that enjoy's the game and seeks out only the decent ones. I will say that I may not be a threat to big stores, but the new tires on my wifes car and the kids college books and the 46" LCD and A LOT of 'extra' things I normally would not do, or dig into the savings and do.....make things pretty nice. Oh, and having the driveway re-paved too......I never claimed to be a huge AP....but when you have an advantage and bet accordingly, with some positive EV, you can do pretty well. I will never quit my day job.

 

[zoomie]

Missing APs

professional APs?

I'd say 100000:1

I agree. I've been playing RPC for over 30 years, some Vegas, fair amount Tahoe, lots in AC. In all of that time I've seen 3 counters, and one of those is my girlfriend. :laugh: Another was a young Asian who ran into some bad flux and dropped probably $6K over 2 bad shoes. The third was a 40+ Caucasian like me, but he was just dropping out on bad counts and flat betting good ones. That's it. I think there are really very few of us.

 

[aslan]

I agree. I've been playing RPC for over 30 years, some Vegas, fair amount Tahoe, lots in AC. In all of that time I've seen 3 counters, and one of those is my girlfriend. :laugh: Another was a young Asian who ran into some bad flux and dropped probably $6K over 2 bad shoes. The third was a 40+ Caucasian like me, but he was just dropping out on bad counts and flat betting good ones. That's it. I think there are really very few of us.

Well, it's not the best of occupations! I mean, who else would want to be up a thousand or a few thousand and down a thousand or a few thousand, up a thousand or a few thousand, and down a thousand or a few thousand, all the while only advancing about $10 to $25 an hour over the long run. It's insane--and I don't know why I keep doing it!!! :laugh:

 

[zengrifter]

From my urban dictionary >>

1. Ploppy

Another word for going to the bathroom, but this happens outdoors and impacts the ground.

2. Ploppy

1. An adjective describing a sad or idiotic comment/person
2. An adjective describing something that is slimy, gooey, pooey or cummy.

3. Hot Sloppy Ploppy*

A particularly nasty bowel movement, especially if it is diarrhea. Often used with the verb drop.

-----
*Someday soon I am going to address a player at the my table thusly:

"My what a hot sloppy ploppy you are!"​

 

[zengrifter]

Ploppy Terminology

Posted By: very bored
Date: 11 Dec 01, 5:29 pm at BJ21

Plop-py n.pl. Plop-pies
A term coined by author Frank Scoblete
to describe a typical uninformed gambler

adj. Plop-py uninformed or idiotic : ploppy plays

tr.v. Plop-pied, Plop-ping, Plop-pies

1. To play in the manner of a ploppy : They were plopping from table to table.

2. To blunder: ploppied his way to bankrupcy.

Plop-ping-ly adv. In a ploppy manner : She ploppingly played the hands as to not attract the pit.

[Latin plopus ignoramus , an idiot who sits himself down]

some relative terms:

Plop n.pl. Plops - informal. short for ploppy

Plop-pi-hood n. The association or fraternity of ploppies.

Plop-pi, (plop-pie) or Plop-ae n. obsolete. variant of ploppies

Plop-pling n.- (From "SUPER PLOPPY" one destined to become a ploppy, or in the prestages of becomming a ploppy

Ops, P-Ops n. slang. a ploppy: yo, wasup my P-ops

Plop-ster n. informal. - a ploppy friend

Plopá, Plopúnda, Plopalapa, Plopí, Plopè - some foreign variations

 

[aslan]

Ploppy Terminology

Posted By: very bored
Date: 11 Dec 01, 5:29 pm at BJ21

Plop-py n.pl. Plop-pies
A term coined by author Frank Scoblete
to describe a typical uninformed gambler

adj. Plop-py uninformed or idiotic : ploppy plays

tr.v. Plop-pied, Plop-ping, Plop-pies

1. To play in the manner of a ploppy : They were plopping from table to table.

2. To blunder: ploppied his way to bankrupcy.

Plop-ping-ly adv. In a ploppy manner : She ploppingly played the hands as to not attract the pit.

[Latin plopus ignoramus , an idiot who sits himself down]

some relative terms:

Plop n.pl. Plops - informal. short for ploppy

Plop-pi-hood n. The association or fraternity of ploppies.

Plop-pi, (plop-pie) or Plop-ae n. obsolete. variant of ploppies

Plop-pling n.- (From "SUPER PLOPPY" one destined to become a ploppy, or in the prestages of becomming a ploppy

Ops, P-Ops n. slang. a ploppy: yo, wasup my P-ops

Plop-ster n. informal. - a ploppy friend

Plopá, Plopúnda, Plopalapa, Plopí, Plopè - some foreign variations

Plop, plop;
Fizz, fizz;
Oh, what a relief it is! :vomit:

The curfew tolls the knell of parting day,
The lowing herd winds slowly o'er the lea,
The ploppy homeward plods his weary way,
And leaves an empty table all to me. :grin:

 

[johndoe]

I agree. I've been playing RPC for over 30 years, some Vegas, fair amount Tahoe, lots in AC. In all of that time I've seen 3 counters, and one of those is my girlfriend. :laugh: Another was a young Asian who ran into some bad flux and dropped probably $6K over 2 bad shoes. The third was a 40+ Caucasian like me, but he was just dropping out on bad counts and flat betting good ones. That's it. I think there are really very few of us.

That's pretty unbelievable to me. I've been AP-ing for a small fraction of that time, and have run into 2-3 times that amount, many of them quite competent.

Still rare, but not THAT rare.

 

[paddywhack]

Gonna agree here too

That's pretty unbelievable to me. I've been AP-ing for a small fraction of that time, and have run into 2-3 times that amount, many of them quite competent.

Still rare, but not THAT rare.

Only been doing this biz for less than 18 months and I've picked out 6 for sure.

 

[aslan]

That's pretty unbelievable to me. I've been AP-ing for a small fraction of that time, and have run into 2-3 times that amount, many of them quite competent.

Still rare, but not THAT rare.

I've seen several over the past three years who seem to know when to put the big money out, but then they do things that are completely unacceptable for an authentic card counter--for example, one fellow was spreading bigtime in a plus count, but then in another shoe, he did the same thing in a terrible negative count.

In another case, this Asian girl was betting large dollars in plus counts, and had all the pit crew buzzing among themselves and staring at her play, but then she would do crazy things like move from two hands to one hand because I moved to two hands (as if the number of hands was her secret for winning), criticizing me soundly for doubling down with A/7 against a dealer 5, and A/2 against a dealer 6. She also constantly played dollar chips on everyone's hands around the table for dealer tips. She repeatedly remarked that "Big money plays," pointing to her five hundred dollar bets, and insinuating that I should do everything she told me to do (don't double down on soft hands (A/2, A/7), and don't change to two hands in plus counts). When I left (loser), she had already given back her thousands of dollars winnings and was now losing thousands of her own. For cover (I'm guessing why), she bet way too much in negative counts besides. A little knowledge....

I have never identified a "good" counter, only some who made so many mistakes they could not possibly be long run winners. I have played with quite a few near perfect BS players. But they generally have certain quirks, like not hitting A/7 against a 9, 10, or A; or not hitting 12 against a dealer 2 or 3 in 6- or 8-deck, or splitting 9s against a dealer 7.

The only time I have played with counters to my knowledge was when I knew they were counters to begin with, having known them outside of the casino first, either from here or from acquaintances elsewhere.

 

[aslan]

I generally play mostly $10 and $15 games, and sometimes $25 games. I wonder if I played more in the HL rooms would I see more counters?