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Hi Ken. I had stated my plan earlier, $2500 Bank, $20 at TC+1 up to $50 at TC+4 on $10 min. table. You had said this is a reasonable approach, but after re-reviewing this lesson would it be more reasonable to wait until TC+2 before going to $20 as if I’m correct TC+1 would be even with the casino. My thinking on this is that the bank would last longer if there’s a negative streak. Thanks, Glen
You are correct that you are just at breakeven expectation at TC+1, so waiting until at least a slightly better true count before raising your bet is a good idea.
In reading back over my answer to your initial question, I want to expand on it. Your bet ramp is a reasonable approach for a small bankroll, but with only a 1 to 5 spread, you won’t actually have a positive expectation unless you leave in most negative counts. This kind of a limited bankroll/limited spread situation is only useful to take a shot at increasing your bank to a useful level. (If you’re even a little unlucky, you’ll likely lose the bank and have to build another.) This spread does not give you a sustainable profitable game. To beat a six deck game, you just need a bigger spread to overcome the house edge. I prefer at least 1 to 12, which would be $5 to $60, or $10 to $120.
It’s very hard to find a $5 table these days in the East, so I could do $10 (and that’s getting hard too) to $120. So then would the bet spread at TC+2 $20, TC+3 $30, up to $120 at TC+12?
Also would the bet spread or TC change at all if using the KO count instead of Hi-Lo (I just bought the Knock Out book)?
And last, I was thinking of taking a shot (like you said) at increasing to a new level using this small (Not really that small to me) bank and if I lose this bank, practice more while raising another bank. OR should I keep practicing while raising the correct bank ($6000 I believe) for this spread?
This site, your quick responses, and professionalism are very refreshing! Thank you! Glen
Thanks, you responded before I even posted my correction, lol. And though I will read the entire KO book ( I know the formula already), I also just wanted to know if the KO TC becomes the same as in Hi-Lo? Also, just to make sure I have it right, TC+2 $20, +3 $40, +4 $80, +5 $100, +6 $120?
KO does not require a conversion to true count, so it’s quite a bit easier to use. The betting process is quite a bit simpler, but still powerful. Although this course from the GameMaster targets Hi-Lo (along with my advanced strategy cards), these days I usually recommend KO as a first count. It’s easy but strong.
And yes, you have the right conversion from the above table to your units.
You would use the full spread by the time you get to either TC+5 or TC+6. Look at the final table in the lesson above. Multiply the amounts by two, and you’ll have a good $10 to $120 spread bet ramp, getting to $120 at TC+6.
As to whether to take a shot with $2500 or wait until you have $6000, only you can decide which you prefer. I would probably go ahead and start with the $2500, with the realization that early bad luck will mean waiting for more ammo.
I understand ken .thanks for the answer!i agree that first thing is to learn the basics.just for the info yesterday i was playing bj and counting everythink was ok 7 at 10 times my bets was correct and sometimes i was deviatied from basic strategy with good results for example is 12 vs 4 or in 12 vs 3.all that finished when they bring new dealer to the table.super super fast hands. I couldnt keep counting.even when i changed to last base as a player i was loosing the count.and her behaviour was very rude to me.
It seems impractical to get enough of a spread that way, and worse, you are at the mercy of another player’s decisions on how to play the hand! Since very few players know correct basic strategy, I wouldn’t recommend back-betting unless you know the person is very competent. Does it look more or less suspicious than betting on your spot? That depends on how common the practice is in your particular casino. In some casinos, backbetting is very popular. At others, it is rare.
Yesterday one guy in a local cazino made something very strange in bj.he took almost 10.000euro
The strange part of corse was that the game was with smc if i tell them correct.the machine that shaffle after every hand .
More strange was his bettings.he was betting for some rounds the minimum 10euro and after sudenly BOOM !!!200euro in each box.he was playing in two boxes and he decided BOOM maximum bets and sometimes he opend also a 3d box.he was taking all the time tens and ases.also the dealer was taking 10 but for some reason never an ace.when the party was over again only two boxes with 10 euro each for some hands and after 6 or 7 hands BOOM !!!maximum bets with 200euro and always 20 or bj.never again see something like that.the funny part was the 3 pit bosses and the floor manager that come running to that table and watching the game.i was also counting with hi/lo but of corse my counting was air !!!his method/counting was working perfect !!!
Hi Ken, I see under recent comments that you replied about the KO system, but I cant see the last few replies. I refreshed and restarted my computer but it seems I can’t see the last few relies, what can I do? Thanks, Glen
Sorry, I removed an unneeded comment to which that was a reply, not realizing that truncated the whole chain. It’s now back in place just above this pair of comments.
Ok, NP, Thank you. You said “….this course from the GameMaster targets Hi-Lo…” so does the Basic Strategy or Betting Sequence/Spread different if I decide to use KO? Thanks again, Glen
No, KO is a completely different approach. While the basic strategy of course does not change, the betting method and the occasional deviation from basic strategy work differently in KO. If it interests you (and it should), my advice is to get the book: Knock-Out Blackjack.
You don’t mention what dealer upcard you are looking at, nor what the rules of the game are. I’m going to assume that maybe you are looking at a single deck game, and the unusual advice of standing with (7,7) vs a dealer Ten. (Or Surrender if available!). Well, single deck is a lot different. The effect of removing each card is substantial in single deck. In this case, what card would you prefer to draw here? Another 7. But there are only two 7s left in the deck. That swings this decision to make standing better than hitting.
My usual caveats: This ONLY happens in single deck. Refer to the Strategy Engine for your exact game’s optimal strategy.
An ASM (automatic shuffling machine) will use a standard discard tray, where most of the cards will be used. Then, all 6+ decks are put into the machine for a shuffle. It’s just a replacement for hand-shuffling after the shoe is used up.
A CSM (continuous shuffle machine) is constantly shuffling the cards between each hand. Used cards are usually accumulated only during the course of a hand, then immediately put back into the machine and shuffled back into the mix.
Card counting works fine with an ASM. In fact, because there is less downtime between shoes, it is a good thing. A CSM on the other hand makes counting useless.
Thanks will let you know if i have any luck thanks for the lessons
Hi Ken.
I had stated my plan earlier, $2500 Bank, $20 at TC+1 up to $50 at TC+4 on $10 min. table. You had said this is a reasonable approach, but after re-reviewing this lesson would it be more reasonable to wait until TC+2 before going to $20 as if I’m correct TC+1 would be even with the casino. My thinking on this is that the bank would last longer if there’s a negative streak.
Thanks,
Glen
You are correct that you are just at breakeven expectation at TC+1, so waiting until at least a slightly better true count before raising your bet is a good idea.
In reading back over my answer to your initial question, I want to expand on it. Your bet ramp is a reasonable approach for a small bankroll, but with only a 1 to 5 spread, you won’t actually have a positive expectation unless you leave in most negative counts. This kind of a limited bankroll/limited spread situation is only useful to take a shot at increasing your bank to a useful level. (If you’re even a little unlucky, you’ll likely lose the bank and have to build another.) This spread does not give you a sustainable profitable game. To beat a six deck game, you just need a bigger spread to overcome the house edge. I prefer at least 1 to 12, which would be $5 to $60, or $10 to $120.
It’s very hard to find a $5 table these days in the East, so I could do $10 (and that’s getting hard too) to $120. So then would the bet spread at TC+2 $20, TC+3 $30, up to $120 at TC+12?
Also would the bet spread or TC change at all if using the KO count instead of Hi-Lo (I just bought the Knock Out book)?
And last, I was thinking of taking a shot (like you said) at increasing to a new level using this small (Not really that small to me) bank and if I lose this bank, practice more while raising another bank. OR should I keep practicing while raising the correct bank ($6000 I believe) for this spread?
This site, your quick responses, and professionalism are very refreshing!
Thank you!
Glen
Sorry, my first question was suppose to read: So then would the bet spread be TC+2 $20, TC+3 $30, up to $120 at TC+12?
Thanks, you responded before I even posted my correction, lol.
And though I will read the entire KO book ( I know the formula already), I also just wanted to know if the KO TC becomes the same as in Hi-Lo?
Also, just to make sure I have it right, TC+2 $20, +3 $40, +4 $80, +5 $100, +6 $120?
KO does not require a conversion to true count, so it’s quite a bit easier to use. The betting process is quite a bit simpler, but still powerful.
Although this course from the GameMaster targets Hi-Lo (along with my advanced strategy cards), these days I usually recommend KO as a first count. It’s easy but strong.
And yes, you have the right conversion from the above table to your units.
You would use the full spread by the time you get to either TC+5 or TC+6.
Look at the final table in the lesson above. Multiply the amounts by two, and you’ll have a good $10 to $120 spread bet ramp, getting to $120 at TC+6.
As to whether to take a shot with $2500 or wait until you have $6000, only you can decide which you prefer. I would probably go ahead and start with the $2500, with the realization that early bad luck will mean waiting for more ammo.
I understand ken .thanks for the answer!i agree that first thing is to learn the basics.just for the info yesterday i was playing bj and counting everythink was ok 7 at 10 times my bets was correct and sometimes i was deviatied from basic strategy with good results for example is 12 vs 4 or in 12 vs 3.all that finished when they bring new dealer to the table.super super fast hands. I couldnt keep counting.even when i changed to last base as a player i was loosing the count.and her behaviour was very rude to me.
Ken when the tc is at least +2 i dont rase my bet i just betting also behind someones bet.u think this looks suspicious?
It seems impractical to get enough of a spread that way, and worse, you are at the mercy of another player’s decisions on how to play the hand! Since very few players know correct basic strategy, I wouldn’t recommend back-betting unless you know the person is very competent. Does it look more or less suspicious than betting on your spot? That depends on how common the practice is in your particular casino. In some casinos, backbetting is very popular. At others, it is rare.
PLEASE Take a look at this …..
Yesterday one guy in a local cazino made something very strange in bj.he took almost 10.000euro
The strange part of corse was that the game was with smc if i tell them correct.the machine that shaffle after every hand .
More strange was his bettings.he was betting for some rounds the minimum 10euro and after sudenly BOOM !!!200euro in each box.he was playing in two boxes and he decided BOOM maximum bets and sometimes he opend also a 3d box.he was taking all the time tens and ases.also the dealer was taking 10 but for some reason never an ace.when the party was over again only two boxes with 10 euro each for some hands and after 6 or 7 hands BOOM !!!maximum bets with 200euro and always 20 or bj.never again see something like that.the funny part was the 3 pit bosses and the floor manager that come running to that table and watching the game.i was also counting with hi/lo but of corse my counting was air !!!his method/counting was working perfect !!!
Hi Ken, I see under recent comments that you replied about the KO system, but I cant see the last few replies. I refreshed and restarted my computer but it seems I can’t see the last few relies, what can I do?
Thanks,
Glen
Sorry, I removed an unneeded comment to which that was a reply, not realizing that truncated the whole chain. It’s now back in place just above this pair of comments.
Ok, NP, Thank you.
You said “….this course from the GameMaster targets Hi-Lo…” so does the Basic Strategy or Betting Sequence/Spread different if I decide to use KO?
Thanks again,
Glen
No, KO is a completely different approach. While the basic strategy of course does not change, the betting method and the occasional deviation from basic strategy work differently in KO. If it interests you (and it should), my advice is to get the book: Knock-Out Blackjack.
Why does your basic strategy recommend always standing on a pair of sevens, where as you hit a hard 14 when the dealer shows 6 or more ?
You don’t mention what dealer upcard you are looking at, nor what the rules of the game are. I’m going to assume that maybe you are looking at a single deck game, and the unusual advice of standing with (7,7) vs a dealer Ten. (Or Surrender if available!). Well, single deck is a lot different. The effect of removing each card is substantial in single deck. In this case, what card would you prefer to draw here? Another 7. But there are only two 7s left in the deck. That swings this decision to make standing better than hitting.
My usual caveats: This ONLY happens in single deck. Refer to the Strategy Engine for your exact game’s optimal strategy.
I’m embarrassed to tell you that I was looking at T-T, not 7-7. These 74 year-old eyes play tricks on me.
Sorry
An ASM (automatic shuffling machine) will use a standard discard tray, where most of the cards will be used. Then, all 6+ decks are put into the machine for a shuffle. It’s just a replacement for hand-shuffling after the shoe is used up.
A CSM (continuous shuffle machine) is constantly shuffling the cards between each hand. Used cards are usually accumulated only during the course of a hand, then immediately put back into the machine and shuffled back into the mix.
Card counting works fine with an ASM. In fact, because there is less downtime between shoes, it is a good thing.
A CSM on the other hand makes counting useless.