I got banned from Fallsview Casino Resort

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banned

Active Member
Comps Fest

Just a quick update, today I got bored and got a few friends together, called up a limo comp from fallsview, went there, got a $200 comp for their sushi bar, ate, got a season 'gift', got back on the limo and home now.

I thought, since they didn't ban me, i have the right to use up my comps, it felt sweet walking around and seeing the same dealers who saw me get backed off, and they were confused and supportive.

In any case, thought I should share that comp story. Part of me was hoping they would try to block me from the comp, then that's when I'd be fired enough to press them with charges.

As for my legal decision, I'm still gathering details, and met one gambling lawyer and I'll share with you our decision very soon. And yes, we do have a case, and this lawyer knew his stuff... not to sound like a sales victim. And i'll of course agree to a performance-based fee for him.

Thanks again for the support, I feel much better now than I did last weekend, and I'm ready to hit Seneca this weekend, not looking forward to the indoor smoking though, I suspect I'm allergic to it.

Anyone go to both casinos? if so, what were the difference in heat.

P.S: I'm going to vegas on christmas day and staying there until after the new years. Though not my first time in vegas, I'm excited and nervous, especially now that I know i'm not as hidden as i thought i was.
 
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Baberuth

Well-Known Member
American side

Love to hear your report on the HL room should you choose those tables. The HL room is slow and you will be watched closely because you will usually be one on one. It was 6 deck, 100 min.
Not uncommon on the 25 and 50 dollar tables to see 2-400 dollar action. Almost everyone I have played with or watched loses. Some large. I guess if you were the big action, you would get checked out. I did play a few times in the HL room in Canada and that room seemed much more comfortable.
Nice to hear you are using your comps and feeling better. I hope you don't draw too much attention to yourself with the lawyer.
 
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SystemsTrader

Well-Known Member
Banned you need to learn to not take back offs so personally, they are just a part of the game. Comps are also not a right and the casino can stop them at any time so its a good idea to use them up. As for the heat at Seneca magnify it about 100 times compared to Fallsview. Keep us updated on your legal action.
 
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victorino

Active Member
Based on the facts I still think the casino is in the right, but...

Banned, I stand corrected. I didn't think that a suit against the casino on the grounds you stated had any legs to stand on. I did some googling and found a case from September 2010 that is quite similar to yours. Although the casino ultimately won, the case went all the way to the Indiana Supreme Court.

A synopsis of the ruling follows, taken from http://www.indianasocialsecuritydisabilityattorney.com/2010/11/indiana_supreme_court_affirms.html,

Indiana Supreme Court Affirms Time Honored Principle

On September 30, 2010, the Indiana Supreme Court, in the case of Donovan v. Grand Victoria Casino & Resort, L.P. --- N.E.2d ---, 2010 WL 3823132 (Ind. 2010), affirmed "one of the time-honored principles of property law" which is "the absolute and unconditional right of private property owners to exclude from their domain those entering without permission." Thomas P. Donovan was an accomplished "card counter" in the game of blackjack. He supplemented his income by successfully using his skill to win in blackjack games in casinos. Apparently the Grand Victoria allowed him to gamble at its blackjack tables. However, the Grand Victoria thought better of its decision and decided not to permit Mr. Donovan at its blackjack tables, although still permitting him access to other games within its casino. Because Ms. Donovan would not agree to be so restricted, the casino evicted Mr. Donovan and placed him on its list of excluded patrons.

Mr. Donovan sued the casino, seeking declaratory judgment that he could not be excluded from playing blackjack. The trial court granted summary judgment for the casino and the Indiana Court of Appeals reversed holding that because Indiana has implemented a comprehensive scheme for regulating riverboat gambling, the casino's right to exclude patrons was partially abrogated. The Supreme Court reversed the trial court and held that the time-honored principle of an absolute and unconditional right of private property owners to exclude others from its property was not changed by the Indiana legislature permitting gambling. This right is may be exercised arbitrarily and without offering any reason. The only limits on the exclusion right are "statutorily imposed prohibitions on exclusions for characteristics such as race and religion.


The Indiana Supreme Court opinion can be found at http://www.in.gov/judiciary/opinions/pdf/09301001fsj.pdf

(Please excuse the posting of outside links if against forum rules. If inappropriate I will remove.)
 
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victorino

Active Member
Just finished reading Indiana Supreme Court opinion...

Interesting dissenting opinion, in which Justice Dickson states,

"Permitting a casino to restrict its patrons only to those customers who lack the skill and ability to play such games well intrudes upon principles of fair and equal competition and provides unfair financial advantages and rewards to casino operators."

(Indiana Supreme Court ruled in favor of the casino, 3-1.)

Also, interesting discussion of Uston v. Resorts Int'l Hotel, Inc., which I'm not currently familiar with...that's next on my reading list!

(Uston v. Resorts Int'l Hotel, Inc., NJ Apellate Court opinion, http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=17703985423193268973&hl=en&as_sdt=2&as_vis=1&oi=scholarr)
(Uston v. Resorts Int'l Hotel, Inc., NJ Supreme Court opinion, http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=7859842388589565866&hl=en&as_sdt=2&as_vis=1&oi=scholarr)
 
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MeWin$

Well-Known Member
Ur Case

It seems to me ur case is missing damages, hence no big cash prize.
The suit will draw attention to yourself, and cost you money.
Also, the worst case scenario is if you win and Ontario becomes another Atlantic City, costing every AP in the province and perhaps the country their livelihood. Why do this?
You should look into Bj21.com Green Chip for their advice and reference materials. There you will get unbiased advice (dont trust lawyers who are perhaps solicicting funds) and many informed opinions.
Its not worth it, man.
Maybe wait a year and go back, but alter your appearance as much as you can eg a wig, different clothes, perhaps a prothesis nose.

Good luck :)
 
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Baberuth

Well-Known Member
Question for Systems Trader

When you say 100 times the heat are you referring to the HL room or in general. Thanks in advance.
 
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banned

Active Member
SystemsTrader said:
In General.
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I concur, they were watching me like hawks when I'd bet as small as three reds, on $5 tables. I'll forever miss fallsview.

As for the legal update, I'm still researching, and weighing out the pros and cons.
 
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victorino

Active Member
banned said:
As for the legal update, I'm still researching, and weighing out the pros and cons.
Click to expand...
if i may ask, what have you found in your research? what have you found to be the pros and cons?
 
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Sucker

Well-Known Member
banned said:
As for my legal decision, I'm still gathering details, and met one gambling lawyer and I'll share with you our decision very soon. And yes, we do have a case, and this lawyer knew his stuff... not to sound like a sales victim. And i'll of course agree to a performance-based fee for him.
Click to expand...
Q: How can you tell when a lawyer is lying to you?
A: His lips are moving.

Good luck with THIS one!

BTW; You DO understand the DIFFERENCE between a performance-based fee and a contingency fee?
 
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Albee

Well-Known Member
What will you sue them for?

I'm confused. You got banned from playing Blackjack and want to sue them. For what??

They told you they don't want you to play there.....which they have the right to do, why in the world would you want to invest money chasing a lawsuit?

Go to the other casino in the falls area, then across the border to the two or there in that state, then go towards the Thousand Island casino.


Regarding the Indiana lawsuit......that was in the US. Not sure how Canada would look at it.
 
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JohnGalt1

Active Member
Banned,

So if your friend stops by your home, goes to to your refrigerator and eats most of your food, and you ask him to leave and not come back, do you believe he has a right to sue you because you will not allow him to come back and eat most of your food again?
 
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BJgenius007

Well-Known Member
JohnGalt1 said:
Banned,

So if your friend stops by your home, goes to to your refrigerator and eats most of your food, and you ask him to leave and not come back, do you believe he has a right to sue you because you will not allow him to come back and eat most of your food again?
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To his defense, he has been stealing the food for years, it is just the first time he got caught. He is just mad that he can't steal any more. The lawsuit is just to help him vend even he knows he can't win.
 
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bjcardcounter

Well-Known Member
JohnGalt1 said:
Banned,

So if your friend stops by your home, goes to to your refrigerator and eats most of your food, and you ask him to leave and not come back, do you believe he has a right to sue you because you will not allow him to come back and eat most of your food again?
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This is not a correct comparison.

BJgenius007 said:
To his defense, he has been stealing the food for years, it is just the first time he got caught. He is just mad that he can't steal any more. The lawsuit is just to help him vend even he knows he can't win.
Click to expand...
He is neither stealing nor cheating.
 
zengrifter

zengrifter

Banned
Sucker said:
Q: How can you tell when a lawyer is lying to you?
A: His lips are moving.

Good luck with THIS one!
Click to expand...
I thought that Canada casino did not or cannot bar counters? Did that change? zg
 
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Sucker

Well-Known Member
Quebec casinos cannot bar counters. Ontario can and does. I have no knowledge about the other provinces.
 
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