Most players are IDIOTS

[FLASH1296]

Counting my (financial) blessings.

When I count my blessings high among them is the self-evident fact that nearly all of the BJ "ploppies" around me are innumerate, illogical, and superstitious.

Sometimes I hum to myself the chorus from that great song "Stuck in the middle with you"

:laugh: "Clowns to the left of me / Jokers to the right / Here I am." :laugh:

Seriously, If most peeps played well the casinos would never let advantage players remove a few crumbs from their coffers.
They would worsen the rules and the penetration to the point of utter transmogrification*.

* transmogrify |transˈmägrəˌfī; tranz-|
verb ( -fies, -fied) [ trans. ] (often be transmogrified) chiefly humorous
transform, esp. in a surprising or magical manner

 

[ChefJJ]

They would worsen the rules and the penetration to the point of utter transmogrification*.

* transmogrify |transˈmägrəˌfī; tranz-|
verb ( -fies, -fied) [ trans. ] (often be transmogrified) chiefly humorous
transform, esp. in a surprising or magical manner

You mean, like install CSMs?!? :grin:

good luck

 

[mulehead126]

If you ever get tried of trying to grind a tiny percentage off of those machines, think about this:

Those same idiots, making similar idiot remarks, are in the poker room. They are waiting to give you their money directly, instead of the casino being a middleman (ie-idiots deposit chips into dealers tray, you get some of them back).

No matter how good you get at poker, the casino will not ban you from the poker room.
:joker:

Hey guys, thanks for all the responses, I appreciate them! BTW, right now I am in Vicksburg (I live in MD and virtually the only place I play live is in AC, which has the worst rules going...so when I am there I DO play mostly poker! I am far from a "great" poker player, but those tables are mostly fishtanks! Usually 2-3 good players, 4-5 players who play almost anything, cause they are there to "gamble, not fold"...LMAO!

Boy, I sure miss those type players who played online before the U.S.A. Gestapo passed that dame Internet Gambling bill (what a crock)...Playing $5-$20 tourneys I made 7K in less than a year and a half...I am sure many of you can top that...like I said, I am no "pro", I just would grind out the cashes and once in while take a tourney down...half the fields are out before an hour has gone by cause it's so easy to just get in another one. I'm preaching to the choir I know...

Anyway to respond to your post Cardcounter, in Delaware it's just slots, no table games at all so BJ is it. I no longer play poker online due to several reasons, but one day I'll be back...

As far as Vicksburg, well compared to AC, the rules here are great! I've been playing a 2 deck handheld game, dealer stays on all 17's, double anything, double after split, and except for one dealer they have been dealing out about 80% of the cards. That one other dealer only dealt about HALF of the two decks! Ridiculous! And BJ's play 3-2, not that 6-5 BULLSHIT.

At first I played vs. a 6 deck shoe game...but they did have late surrender, I haven't seen that in at least 20 years - or more maybe?

I don't count, though I keep an eye on how many A's and face cards have been coming out (lazy man's counting?), but even then haven't varied my bets much. And I am ON FIRE! I can't afford to play for as much as I'd like cause I'm on an extended mostly non-gambling vacation, but I sure as hell ain't complaining! I've been here five days and have won every day...I know this can't last...

 

[mulehead126]

With the exception of well funded teams, casinos need not be paranoid about cardcounting because the percentage of idiots on the tables is probably 1,000's of times higher than the percentage of counters.

I recently shared a table in a high limit room with a guy betting two hands of between $2,000-$5,000 and doing things like splitting 2,2 vs A. He drops 75,000 in less than an hour.
Should the casino mind that I took in about $5,000 in that time period?
No, the casino should have paid me a commission because the guy was in the area but was waiting for another player to come in because he did not want to play alone.

This kind of player is in every casino, some play better than others but they are all losers who somehow believe that without any math they will come out winners. It is all in the beauty of the game (for the casino that is), every terrible player you witness can tell you about the day where he did win big, where variance or lady luck smiled upon his cards hand after hand. That bit of ignorant luck has kept him coming back, expecting that luck again while giving all of his money to the casino.
As a long time advantage player, I have often been witness to a horrid player on a great run, while perhaps I am getting my butt kicked. You know how things will work out eventually, but at the time you can only wonder why you can not get "his cards"?

Meanwhile, the casino continues to rack in the money

That's a big pet peeve of mine, the paranoid pit bosses. They should realize the few really expert counters that grind it out bring in many counters who still lose cause of their mistakes. But they'll let idiots and drunks play all night while their beady eyes look for the devious counters taking advantage of the poor casinos.

And nothing sucks more than having a bad session while some clown can't lose a hand if he tried.

 

[mulehead126]

Try counting the number of cards dealt before the virtual dealer changes. That should be around the 202-210 mark. If so, assume each dealer starts with a fresh shoe.

Yeah, I did try figuring when the decks might be "shuffled"...till I noticed that the virtual dealers change even when no one is playing. Looks to be about 15 minutes or so for each dealer.

That makes sense, for them to make it impossible to tell when the decks are shuffled, cause with $10-$500 tables with no "pit bosses", expert counters would tear those things up...assuming it's an honest game of course!

 

[mulehead126]

Next time you see some idiot doing something stupid like splitting 5's against a 10, ask them if you can bet them that they will come out a loser on that hand. Same goes for when someone wants to take even money on their blackjack. Offer to give them 2-1 odds that the dealer doesn't have bj This is assuming of course the count is in your favor.

Great story about splitting 5's...

I was at Wheeling Island, WV about a year ago at a $5 table and 1st base has 5-5 vs. a 8, puts out another stack, gets a 10...and THEN tells the dealer "I wanted to split"...LMAO!!! The dealer calls the pit boss, etc. etc., bottom line is he got to split, had to keep the 10, he then STAYS vs. the 8, gets another 10 on the other 5, again stays, and loses to dealer's 18...HILARIOUS!

 

[Tarzan]

Pat them on the back...

Chef and Flash made the real point of the matter, which is that the casinos NEED those people and LOTS OF THEM! Those are the people keeping the game profitable for the casinos. SOMEBODY has to pay that lighting/electric bill otherwise the casinos can't afford to offer a blackjack game that they can only grind one or two percentage points out of. Even someone that adheres to basic strategy with no mistakes is not truly making them any serious money. They need those whacko people who have all appearances of just having climbed off "the short bus" from the local mental institution willing to make horrific strategy blunders and ultimately take that big fall with it only being a matter of time.

Love those people, admire those people... pat them on the back even. Never be discouraged by the stupidity of others at the blackjack table because they are what makes the world go 'round! They are doing all the other players a favor by keeping the game extremely profitable for the casino.

 

[mulehead126]

Vs. the Shufflemasters, it is incredible how many players I see who stay with A4 or A5! But maybe that's because their total is shown as 15 or 16, instead of what it should say, 5/15 or 6/16, etc.

Why players who know nothing about BJ don't just stick to slots or roulette I'll never figure out. But good point made be several of you, if not for the complete idiots the casinos might not even deal BJ.

 

[KOLAN]

Personally I think anyone who risks their money in a game they don't fully understand how to play is an idiot. I guess that makes 99% of bj players idiots :grin:

If I got paid $1 everytime someone told me I was supposed to stand on a 12 vs a dealer 2 or dealer 3 in a 6 or 8 deck game when the count wasn't positive enough to warrant that, I'd be making a nice bundle.
Here are in my opinion the 5 most common ploppie errors when it comes to basic strategy.

1. Standing on a 12 vs dealer 3
2. Standing on a 12 vs dealer 2
3. Standing on a soft 18 on anything the dealer has.
4. Standing on 15 vs a dealer 10
5. Failing to double down on any soft hands or 9's.

4. Standing on 15 vs a dealer 10
jast take 1 deck players 15 dealer 10 mixed hit 10 times and stand 10 times and you gona see hu is ideots

 

[mulehead126]

Heard/saw the following, all from different players, all within an hour or so:

"You never split 9's. That's just being greedy."

"Eighteen is a winning hand." (Said each time when I doubled A7 v. 5).

"Did he just hit that soft 18?" [Against dealer 10]

"I'll let the table vote and decide for me: should I split these 5's or double down?"

"Don't split those 4's [against dealer 6], because you don't want to take too many 10's away from the dealer. Just double it." [At a neutral/neg count.]

"Surrender is for suckers," followed closely by "You were supposed to take a hit and save the table." [Never mind that the hit would have busted me.]

and my all time favorite...

"You'll take the dealer's bust card."

For some reason none of these things bothered me or seemed the slightest bit odd before I started playing serious BS and counting.

Just last night, after I split 7's vs. a 6, doubled a 10 on one of the hands (and lost both), this pinhead says to me "Come on man, we need to play together"...oh, OK...WTF is "playing together"?

Beefcake, maybe that's when you were supposed to take a hit that busted you "for the table"...that's "playing together"!

 

[mulehead126]

When I count my blessings high among them is the self-evident fact that nearly all of the BJ "ploppies" around me are innumerate, illogical, and superstitious.

Sometimes I hum to myself the chorus from that great song "Stuck in the middle with you"

:laugh: "Clowns to the left of me / Jokers to the right / Here I am." :laugh:

Seriously, If most peeps played well the casinos would never let advantage players remove a few crumbs from their coffers.
They would worsen the rules and the penetration to the point of utter transmogrification*.

* transmogrify |transˈmägrəˌfī; tranz-|
verb ( -fies, -fied) [ trans. ] (often be transmogrified) chiefly humorous
transform, esp. in a surprising or magical manner

I've sung (not hummed) that same song many a night in our home poker games...:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:

 

[FLASH1296]

Kolan,

It is correct to stand on Soft 18 vs. a dealer 7 or 8

 

[gordon5432]

Personally I think anyone who risks their money in a game they don't fully understand how to play is an idiot. I guess that makes 99% of bj players idiots :grin:

If I got paid $1 everytime someone told me I was supposed to stand on a 12 vs a dealer 2 or dealer 3 in a 6 or 8 deck game when the count wasn't positive enough to warrant that, I'd be making a nice bundle.
Here are in my opinion the 5 most common ploppie errors when it comes to basic strategy.

1. Standing on a 12 vs dealer 3
2. Standing on a 12 vs dealer 2
3. Standing on a soft 18 on anything the dealer has.
4. Standing on 15 vs a dealer 10
5. Failing to double down on any soft hands or 9's.

The costliest plays that most ploppies make are imo:

1. Playing side bets like royal match (can't resist the allure of a 22-1 payout)
2. Playing 6-5 games (the only thing that truly makes me want to smack them upside the head, but mathematically still better than side bets)
3. Taking insurance (95% of players take even money, majority take insurance with 20 as well)
4. Standing on 16v7-8 (costly, but a lot of players know to hit)
5. Always standing on A7 (doesn't come up too often, only REALLY bad v 9)
6. Never surrendering (I'm semi-guilty of this, as a BS player I only surrender 16vT, when I start playing for real as an AP I'll obviously change this)

Other near-universal mistakes are standing on 12v2-3, hitting 88vT, and various mistakes with hitting v doubling soft hands, but they aren't really all that costly. Most players at least know better than to, say, stand on A6.

 

[mulehead126]

Even costlier is insuring a bad hand. I can see the logic in insuring a 20 when a casual player does it. I admit to usually insuring a BJ, specially in this two deck game I'm playing in the casino I'm at now, it doesn't take much to make that actually the correct play. There's just something about pushing a BJ that I don't like.

And way, way too many players surrender way too often, it's another house rule that in theory benefits the player but in fact benefits the casino. Try explaining to them that they only need to win 1 in 4 "surrenderable" hands to break even on that option!

Finally, I've taken more grief over hitting a soft 18 vs. a dealer's 9, 10 or Ace than any other play. Specially if I end up busting. If I catch an Ace, 2 or 3, I was foolish but lucky in their minds.

Any player should realize that side bets are very bad propositions for the player, but here in Vicksburg they have one I've never seen, it's 3 card poker, if your two cards and the dealer's up cards yield trips, a flush or a straight you get paid 9 to 1 (only on the 6 deck game, not the handheld two deck. I'd sure like to know how the actual odds on that bet were figured...I'm thinking it should pay about 11 to 1 the way side bets rape players. But it does appear maybe to be better than some of the other side bets I've seen, it sure gets a lot of action - at least half of the players play it every hand, and not many players never play it. When I played the 6 deck game, EVERY time I would have hit the 3 card bet I took grief for not playing it.

 

[FLASH1296]

mulehead126,

Where do you play that this is true?

"And way, way too many players surrender way too often"

In my experience the vast majority of ploppies will not surrender any hand.

I have played long sessions where nobody other than myself surrendered any hands.

 

[bjtocki]

I have seen a lady with side bet winning streak, probably changed $500 and won $3500 in 25 minutes. She probably only won about $200 with hands only. The funny thing is that all the other players started to side bet... and I had to do the same for camouflage betting only $1 and $2 (I mean you will stand out if you don't on that occasion).

 

[bjtocki]

mulehead126,

Where do you play that this is true?

"And way, way too many players surrender way too often"

In my experience the vast majority of ploppies will not surrender any hand.

I have played long sessions where nobody other than myself surrendered any hands.

I do see that often at Foxwoods (can always spot one or two in a trip). The worst, I've seen a lady by me surrendering probably 1 in every 4 hands by getting 14, 15, 16 against dealer's 9, 10, A. But most ploppies will not surrender because they think it will help the dealer and it's quite annoying when they try to educate you about it when you do so.

 

[EasyRhino]

21+3 was crazy popular when I saw it in Missouri (both sides) a few years ago.

 

[ihate17]

"Blackjack is a team sport", NOT!

Just last night, after I split 7's vs. a 6, doubled a 10 on one of the hands (and lost both), this pinhead says to me "Come on man, we need to play together"...oh, OK...WTF is "playing together"?

Beefcake, maybe that's when you were supposed to take a hit that busted you "for the table"...that's "playing together"!

If the other players are covering part of your loses and you are sharing your wins with them, then you could call blackjack a team game. Sure we all are playing against the dealer but it is more complicated, it is every man for himself against the dealer.

A great hand for this is doubling a soft 18 and getting something like a 21 while the dealer turns his hole, has a total of ten and hits a ten. He kills everyone on the table but pays you and you start hearing that if you had stayed the dealer would have busted, but no one ever offered to pay you to stay.

ihate17

 

[ohbehave]

Just play along with the ploppies. Its great for cover. I love it when all the drunk ploppies are talking about playing together. You just agree right along with them... and then play your hand your own way. There's nothing you or they can do to change anything without knowing the next card so jump in there and act like one of them.