luck

blackchipjim

Well-Known Member
sloppy start

I use to think luck was all that a person needed to play bj and win. I advanded to bs and luck to come out ahead. I advanded to bs with a rudimentary tracking theory on the shoe to advance myself with a little luck. Then I was tired of being down overall for the few times I played and started to learn how to become proficeint at counting. The luck factor played out this weekend the cards were there when they were suppose to be and luckily they were dealt to me and yes I did say luck. I have sat countless times at the table at high counts when everone else was getting the high cards and me with a bust hand. blackchipjim
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
decisions, decisions, decisions

blackchipjim said:
I use to think luck was all that a person needed to play bj and win. I advanded to bs and luck to come out ahead. I advanded to bs with a rudimentary tracking theory on the shoe to advance myself with a little luck. Then I was tired of being down overall for the few times I played and started to learn how to become proficeint at counting. The luck factor played out this weekend the cards were there when they were suppose to be and luckily they were dealt to me and yes I did say luck. I have sat countless times at the table at high counts when everone else was getting the high cards and me with a bust hand. blackchipjim
what your saying is in line with what i'm hearing others say about luck.
more or less luck is there in one form or the other you play AP techniques and luck is ancillary but a part of the process. luck takes a back seat in to the ev of AP techniques. it's freely admitted that it's there in one form or the other and thats about it. save for one idea i've heard quoted about something Schlesinger is reported to have said in Blackjack Attack regarding more or less i think our fears of the possible consequences of risk of ruin. that statement being that 'if they don't get you early on they just might not get you'. perhaps in that sense one might regard that scenerio as an advantage of luck in the case that one might be so lucky lol.
so but maybe in that instance where we press on with AP play or maybe even we back off from it if 'it looks like they are getting us early on' there is some recognition of a function of luck. the idea opens up the question of making a judgement call maybe as to play on or back off and regroup.
it seems with out the element of thoughtful judgement regarding this principle and the element of luck involved would make Schelsinger's statement rather mundane and useless to the point of just an observation and nothing more.
so maybe the question becomes what else is the AP doing or even a voodoo practitioner doing that involves luck that perhaps calls for thoughtful judgement. the question might even be if there are advantages to be gleaned with regard to what ever procedures we follow and luck then might thoughtful judgement be a key element?
 

blackjack avenger

Well-Known Member
They Can't Catch You If You Are Way Ahead

I am going to present some disgusting math, but I will get back on point:joker::whip:

I believe what Sch was talking about was that as you build units it's harder for you to lose half of bank or all of it.

An example:

fixed kelly ror 13.53%
1/2 fixed kelly ror 1.83%

If you double your initial kelly bank with fixed bets your ror from that point forward is 1.83%.

Think of a mathematical marathon race, once you have a big lead they can't catch you.

Even if you resize frequently you can still get distance if you only bet a fraction of your advantage.

Betting small in relation to your bankroll even at the beginning of the race is giving you the lead when considering losing all vs long term playing.

The rule of the luck thread is you must mention luck in every post.

So yes some luck; especially early, can be a good thing:joker::whip:
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
the cards don't care if you pray or do math

blackjack avenger said:
I am going to present some disgusting math, but I will get back on point:joker::whip:
dost thou nay fear oh vengeful one the angst of the bullet-catcher. lest we push the empirical envelope into science in the realm of voodoo land hence forever more locking this thread closed. :p
I believe what Sch was talking about was that as you build units it's harder for you to lose half of bank or all of it.
i guess. kinda makes sense doesn't it? kind of the idea is at least one has some wiggle room. i found the phrase "if they didn't get us early, they weren't going to get us at all" on page 145 in Chapt 8 Risk of Ruin of Blackjack Attack. for some reason i think he used the phrase else where as well maybe. i like the phrase reworded 'if they don't get you early on they just might not get you' better.
An example:

fixed kelly ror 13.53%
1/2 fixed kelly ror 1.83%

If you double your initial kelly bank with fixed bets your ror from that point forward is 1.83%.
i'm guessing that works for cutting your bets in half as well? assumming the table min allows for it?
that kelly stuff i think it came from some guy with the phone company. had to do with information rates over noisey phone lines or something.
ahh here we go serendipity that it is of value for blackjack. :rolleyes:
Think of a mathematical marathon race, once you have a big lead they can't catch you.

Even if you resize frequently you can still get distance if you only bet a fraction of your advantage.

Betting small in relation to your bankroll even at the beginning of the race is giving you the lead when considering losing all vs long term playing.
well ok and maybe you could bet larger in the beginning of the race and then bet small if need be as the race ensues? where by betting large (within Kelly) and having the option to bet small (proportionaly) or i guess like you say vice-versa is like in a sense an insurance policy on your bets.
the weird thing is that in the short run even with out an advantage this sort of stuff (even in a voodoo sense) has a pretty good chance of working at least for a while.
http://www.blackjackinfo.com/bb/showthread.php?p=95946#post95946
with the idea being say your lucky and get ahead it's like a freebee over the work extended via advantage play and you always have advantage play to fall back on. in a sense it's like an insurance policy only you know your gonna need to invoke it at some point. lmao.
The rule of the luck thread is you must mention luck in every post.
that's just camo play to keep the bullet catcher from tossing us outa the voodoo forum lmao.
So yes some luck; especially early, can be a good thing:joker::whip:
so yeah i think the kelly example helps show that. in my mental mind it shows how having the freedom to observe your results and know how they relate to certain maths of AP blackjack and having the freedom to change how you play accordingly might give one a leg up on luck or at least a handle on lady luck so as to try and grab her. :devil:
 

bjcount

Well-Known Member
Non mathematically speaking, The best luck

i had was when the judge signed the divorce papers on the East coast right before I said I do in Vegas!

If you ask my wife she'll tell you, if it wasn't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all...:cry:

It's all skill, good old fashion hard work. Study hard, keep your mind and eyes open, absorb it all, and practice, practice, practice...

BJC.
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
all work and no play makes bj dull

bjcount said:
i had was when the judge signed the divorce papers on the East coast right before I said I do in Vegas!

If you ask my wife she'll tell you, if it wasn't for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all...:cry:
i just hope that wasn't entirely serendipidy. maybe you had a well orchestrated plan with perfect timing.:rolleyes:
It's all skill, good old fashion hard work. Study hard, keep your mind and eyes open, absorb it all, and practice, practice, practice...

BJC.
reminds me of how most of my life it was drilled into my head about the virtues of hard work. i actually do believe in it.
i was a little taken aback in physics 101 when one of the students mentioned something about how you can't get something for nothing and how you have to work hard to get any where in life. the physics professor responded that "No, you don't really have to work all that hard." just so happens the topic of the day was work and levers and pulleys ect.
so yeah we can do things with good old fashion hard work but it's possible that work can be performed in various ways or steps that aren't really so hard. but maybe the study and practice and keeping ones eyes open with an open mind and taking it all in might lead to differant approachs to getting the same thing done.
skill is another thing that is open to examination. isn't shooting a three pointer in basketball a skill. it's a different kind of process than counting cards. and same with maybe a wine taster. a dog sniffing out drugs. so maybe a robot could hit a three pointer every time and a NBA player can't and maybe a machine can determine the chemical constituents of a glass of wine or suitcase full of drugs. just a matter of precision. then with all that you have the measurement problem and the degree of certainty that you can associate with your measurements. it's like with card counting that degree of certainty has a lot of uncertainty built in even ignoring some amount of standard error. humane error just adds to it. play perfectly like a computer simulation and you get maybe 1% thru 2% advantage over the long run.
your gonna need luck to play that good and a heck of a lot of intestinal fortitude.
so but anyone who can do all that you have to admire their abilities and strength of conviction.
 

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bjcount

Well-Known Member
sagefr0g said:
i just hope that wasn't entirely serendipidy. maybe you had a well orchestrated plan with perfect timing.:rolleyes:

but maybe the study and practice and keeping ones eyes open with an open mind and taking it all in might lead to differant approachs to getting the same thing done.

so but anyone who can do all that you have to admire their abilities and strength of conviction.
Oh yes a plan well orchestrated, took a year and a half in the making, and worth every second!

16 years later I am setting my plans to take on the tables. It's going to be a hard slow battle, whether it be luck or Extreme skill, I will conquer! I think it's a skill when you can combine counting, shuffle tracking, ace prediction, and money management all at the same time. It's also a skill to know when to get up and leave when it's just not going your way.

skill1 [skil] noun
1)cleverness at doing something, resulting either from practice or from natural ability
2)a job or activity that requires training and practice; an art or craft

Had many of those boring days playing BJ too, trading up and down for hours at every table... Had to chat with the waitresses to stay awake......Still, it beats mowing the lawn or painting the house.

BJC
 

blackjack avenger

Well-Known Member
A Little Luck Can Be All or No Difference

In this mathematical marathon of long run vs losing all, think of the importance of winning the first time you play.

If you don't resize you are closer to ruin and you have to run far to get even.

If you resize your bets downward you are less likely to lose all but you are even farther behind in number of hands needed to get even.

Perhaps if you had just a little luck:joker::whip:
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
bjcount said:
Oh yes a plan well orchestrated, took a year and a half in the making, and worth every second!
wow so yeah you are a planner and follow through on your plans. thats pretty amazing, it's like for me maybe just fumbling my way through life one minute to the next. it's rare that things work out for any amount of time for any plan i come up with.
16 years later I am setting my plans to take on the tables. It's going to be a hard slow battle, whether it be luck or Extreme skill, I will conquer! I think it's a skill when you can combine counting, shuffle tracking, ace prediction, and money management all at the same time.
so it sounds like you really intend to make the AP thing happen and do it the right way. almost sounds like your going to give the pro thing a shot?
It's also a skill to know when to get up and leave when it's just not going your way.
i'm almost suprised to see that statement in your post. i think you probably know thats an almost voodoo statement. but then maybe your meaning it more from the perspective of maybe poor play because maybe you let yourself get tired so time to end a session, poor conditions so give it a break, to much heat ect. ect. maybe instead of the voodoo implication of escaping from bad luck, i guess.
skill1 [skil] noun
1)cleverness at doing something, resulting either from practice or from natural ability
2)a job or activity that requires training and practice; an art or craft
yup that's it all right. that's what i was ranting about. like for me one natural ability is estimating stuff. i'm a little like that guy Monk on tv where everything has to be just so. lmao. so but if the symmetry (to my mind) is off then it stands out. just have some sort of sensitivity about that. it's weird though i couldn't tell you a pile of six decks from eight decks by just looking at them. i have to practice that by seeing the two before i recognize them. but mentally breaking them down into one, two, three... decks in the discard tray comes easy once i know what i'm dealing with. but i'm the guy who everyone ask's to get a picture hung straight or space out just so when nobody has one of those laser beam thinga majobs around to do the job. lol.
Had many of those boring days playing BJ too, trading up and down for hours at every table... Had to chat with the waitresses to stay awake......Still, it beats mowing the lawn or painting the house.

BJC
now thats a weird one for me. the longest i've played a session was 21 hours and the thing was i was loving it. i wouldn't of maybe even quit then if it hadn't of been i lost all my trip bankroll. :(
the thing that gets me bored is like counting and counting down shoes and for the longest only rarely ever seeing a 'decent' positive count. but then i don't know what i should expect cause i've mainly played six and eight deckers. i've just started playing double deck some and it's quite invigorating the pace of the game and getting to see some positive counts flit in and out of existance more often. :cool:
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
A Little Luck Can Be All or No Difference
ahmen brotha.
blackjack avenger said:
In this mathematical marathon of long run vs losing all, think of the importance of winning the first time you play.
yep i get your drift. problem there with me is i'm not able to be honest with myself about what my bottom line lifetime bankroll is in the first place. i can only come to the point of saying ok ideally such and such is my lifetime bankroll.
but i know probably when it gets down to the nittly gritty and say i lost some 'mind numbing' portion of that roll that i'd probably chicken out or at least make some change in an attempt to mitigate the loss of the rest of the roll.
If you don't resize you are closer to ruin and you have to run far to get even.
yes, yes and yes.
If you resize your bets downward you are less likely to lose all but you are even farther behind in number of hands needed to get even.
exactly.
Perhaps if you had just a little luck:joker::whip:
luck certainly wouldn't hurt the situation would it?
but to me these are very interesting points your making. not just for AP play but maybe for some voodoo stuff (some betting system) as well. both instances suffer under the same scenario that you illustrate. of course the voodoo suffers the worst from it. and yeah the voodoo is hopeless in the long run. but still maybe not in the short run and maybe not at all if backed up by advantage play.
but for either how about the idea of how one balances the risks involved?
like in AP play if for some reason we think it's a good chance of getting a blackjack, more successful doubles than not and good insurance bets then it might be worth it for us to take a bigger risk and conversly if we think it's just a chance of getting a normal hand then more risk isn't worth it. so in AP play the risk scenerio is balanced properly and to my mind the bet resizing falls in line with all that. so the scenerio you make is just the facts of life. and luck will do what it's gonna do such is life. expectation reigns supreme and risk is what it is and you can resize affecting risk under certain constraints (kelly) with certain consequences (needing to play more or less hands). and maybe resizing has it's limits for AP's since table min's are a fact of life.
the voodoo part with luck is more complicated. it's a purer gamble. you have more degree's of freedom with respect to risk because of your virtual complete ignorance. like again back to this example:
http://www.blackjackinfo.com/bb/showthread.php?p=95946#post95946
in the shortest most simple way to say it. is say for some negative ev game a flat betting basic strategy player with unit X loses some amount Y. lets say that amount Y is the amount the player expects to lose over some amount of time or hands played.
so now the player changes his unit to Y and plays on in the same manner.
chances are not so bad that the player will be up a unit in fairly short order and hence be back to even from where he started bankroll wise. so now he can go back to betting unit X or what ever. but lets just say this player wants to break even and with luck maybe come out a 'little' ahead.
but here your scenario really weighs heavy. it's like ok you've lost some amount Y and you decided to resize. so but now the question becomes how many hands is it gonna take to get up a unit? how much deeper am i gonna have to dig my self in before i get up a unit if i ever get up a unit? when should i stop and maybe give up and maybe try some AP to dig my way out?
problem being until you infact make up that unit you need to play more hands but what can happen is you just dig your self deeper and deeper, way deeper than that original amount Y that your trying to make up. it's a pretty dreadful situation that can arise from what started out as a fairly promising propostition. it's not in essence much differant than the math marathon race scenario's you mention. resizing with possible consequences and hands to play to hopefully get back on track again.
so for this voodoo scenerio when the player is risking the X unit it's a fairly even game albeit losing over time however he could get lucky and come out some amount ahead or break even in the short run. but in the case where he lost Y then when he's risking the Y unit his play has greater risk relatively speaking if either scenerio was to play out until some bankroll was nearly completely lost. so the player having the goal of either breaking even after some amount of play or even comming out a little ahead by luck has the two risk scenario's to contend with. (let's not worry about the question of how much luck is enough luck as far as the goal goes).
the first scenario where player bets an X unit is the least risky. that's where he wants to play all of his hands if possible. the real problem comes should he happen to lose Y and feels compelled to now switch to the Y unit. his problem being that he needs to play some unknown number of hands before he's up a unit. it could be as many as fifty hands or more and yet he could still lose the whole bankroll just trying to get up one unit. and that's not good even though his chances are pretty good he will get up one unit it's also true that there will be times he won't and he'll lose the whole bank. definately bad news. what to do? the player at this point should bite the bullet and set some amount he's willing to lose before stopping play. what amount? it should be some amount Z that the player can reasonably make up in some amount of time reasonable to the player where he plays card counting using X as a unit until he makes up the amount Z or better as expectation and luck would have it.
such might be the life of a recreational player content with breaking even or experiencing a bit of luck but who would still be willing to knuckle down and count cards if need be with the hope of staying in the black. sigh.
other than that maybe be willing to lose that amount Z for that trip (where Z<= 1sd. dev. then hope for luck of making a sd. dev. win by luck for the next trip. :joker::whip:
edit: summary shooting for luck else AP play.... (note: voodoo credits per Kasi lmao)
flat bet -ev game using basic strategy where:
unit = X
let Z <= 1 std. dev.
if win Z over intial bank stop (that is likely as much as a ideal card counter wins)
if lose Y (where Y = -ev for hands played)
then make unit = Y
now play until making one unit (this would be where bankroll is back to even)
if lose Z
then play AP with unit= X until Z amount is made up.
 

Kasi

Well-Known Member
sagefr0g said:
it's like ok you've lost some amount Y and you decided to resize. so but now the question becomes how many hands is it gonna take to get up a unit?
Well, you already discovered with 12 units if you haven't turned it into 13 after 50 hands not much point in playing more hands since it tops out. Maybe the opposite of "if they don't get you early...". Maybe it's the same thing lol. You'll lose it quick or you won't.

So in our silly example take $480 )12 units) play 50 hands and if you haven't made it, maybe lost it all before then, what the heck, you're only down $520 and can do it again with another 2 unit roll lol.

Of course, to make $40 with 250 unhits or whatever might as well go voodoo all the way and play some even money game that will win you that unit 99% of the time lol.

Or if you need units, just go for $20 and you're good for 5000 more hands anyway lol.

Isn't voodoo fun lol. Always a little luck involved lol. Sometimes maybe very little lol.

10,000 units is a lot lol.
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
card counting is valuable camo for voodoo practitioners

Kasi said:
Well, you already discovered with 12 units if you haven't turned it into 13 after 50 hands not much point in playing more hands since it tops out. Maybe the opposite of "if they don't get you early...". Maybe it's the same thing lol. You'll lose it quick or you won't.
exactly 50 hands or so might as well be a limiting factor. why that is? or how does that come about that way? inquiring minds want to know but haven't a clue. lol. just a guess that say maybe the effect of standard deviation is relatively strong early on and dissapates relatively quickly or that at least the effect sort of quickly starts evening out. much quicker than one might at first blush imagine?:confused:
So in our silly example take $480 )12 units) play 50 hands and if you haven't made it, maybe lost it all before then, what the heck,...
here i'm still interested lmao... (ie. i like the what the heck part :eyepatch:)
...you're only down $520 and can do it again with another 2 unit roll lol.
yeah i get the point...
being cheap, real cheap ($5 is too much, that sort of cheap) the concept begins to become problematic in that sense.
so but anyway if one wasn't so cheap isn't this where the problem of diminishing returns (not to mention diminishing table max's) becomes a not so attractive spectre?
that's why i copped out on the pure voodoo with the idea of setting some loss limit and using the alternative of using orthodox counting to recoup loss's.
Of course, to make $40 with 250 unhits or whatever might as well go voodoo all the way and play some even money game that will win you that unit 99% of the time lol.
so far even my seven year old grandson beats me in craps. :laugh:
Or if you need units, just go for $20 and you're good for 5000 more hands anyway lol.
yeah i was lookin at that too. i been setting sage software up all sorts of ways looking to see a way to avoid the inevitable lmao.
so far it looks like the playing less than or up to 50 hands (could be differant depending on the game i guess) and watching for some 'decent' gain seems the most attractive option. it's like if you limit the simulator to play just 50 hands yeah you might end up loser a lot but if you look at the stats you find that at various points (edit: unfortunately not all the time) your up a 'decent' amount before the 50 hands are played out. so what ever one does it might be worth while keeping an eye on the bottom line and making a judgement call about maybe bailing early with a little less recovery than hoped for sorta of thing. :rolleyes:
Isn't voodoo fun lol. Always a little luck involved lol. Sometimes maybe very little lol.
it beats the hell out of counting down 75% tc<=0 eight and six deck shoes for two years only to make $6000 all the while probably not even doing it right in the first place.:joker::whip:
10,000 units is a lot lol.
:cow: one can dream. lol.
i'm looking for a 1 cent table min with a 100 dollar max. would that be a black swan? :joker:
edit:
here's some interesting looking links: (think maybe i'll read them lol)
http://www.blackjackincolor.com/blackjackrisk1.htm
http://www.blackjackincolor.com/blackjackrisk2.htm
http://www.blackjackincolor.com/blackjackrisk3.htm
http://www.blackjackincolor.com/blackjackrisk4.htm
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
it's a psychological issue

hey canceler
you found me out on this issue long ago ole buddy :p
http://www.blackjackinfo.com/bb/showpost.php?p=96631&postcount=5
consider these issues:
http://www.blackjackinfo.com/bb/showpost.php?p=96637&postcount=5

so where is the advantage?
first off. know thyself. :joker::whip:
i don't think you are a pro? read no further if you are a pro.
if your a recreational player wanting to make some dough what would you spend that dough on? something to make you happy, feel secure and at harmony with the universe, perhaps.
how do you feel when you quit and you are ahead? do the birds sing sweeter, is the sky as crisp and blue as when you were a child, is music more resounding, are friends viewed with more endearment, are you more of a hero in your wife's eyes? if not take some of that hard earned cash and buy her some flowers. lmao.
any other advantage? yup....
you play better when you feel better.
another advantage is having a bit more money for the next time you wanna play makes your bankroll a bit higher and that lowers you ROR just a tad.
that might not be such a bad thing cause if your like me your counting skills may not be pro level or you might just every so often lose your cool and steam or what ever. best to blow some of that house money on nonsense such as that. :rolleyes:
i hope you didn't read this far and that your a pro making lots of loot. :cat:
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
fractals & chance

here's an interesting link for laymen and fractals:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB8m85p7GsU&feature=related
there's six parts...
worth a watch especially when they talk about fractals and chance.
also interesting how the one guy determined how to use the idea of fractals for compressing and uncompressing image information. the interesting thing bieng how it was possible to take a fuzzy virtualy unrecognizable image and apply a fractal application to it and resolve the fuzzy image into a clear recognizable image. extrapolating as it were with fractals to in a sense predict what something is.
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
religion, chance & luck

ok this is about the stock market and not casino's but it's still got to do with
something on chance, making bets and what one believes:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AxJvgbkDhng

so on the question
"Who was that MIT expert who said that to become a pro card counter requires luck. You better believe it. Why I didn't go broke the first month out of the gate, I'll never know! Somebody up their must have been looking out for me. Oh, that's right, can't bring the spirit world into this. Voooodoooo. I like the old saying, "Work as if everything depended on you, and pray as if everything depended on God." That about sums it up."
one might wonder about Taleb's take on experts in the financial world and AP experts in the casino world and the question of luck.
or another way of putting it would be maybe the expert AP for casinos are more real experts than 'experts' in the financial world and still the question is what does "work as if everything depended on you mean" and do our casino experts have God figured out? or another way to put it is does our relationship to/with God have anything to do with luck in a casino?
me thinks it does. not that God cares (about card playing in a casino), but doesn't God have one 'weak spot' in that He's always got to be on the right side of a matter? if we can manage to be on that side doesn't God have to be there with us?
 

sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
more on fractals and prediction

sagefr0g said:
here's an interesting link for laymen and fractals:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qB8m85p7GsU&feature=related
there's six parts...
worth a watch especially when they talk about fractals and chance.
also interesting how the one guy determined how to use the idea of fractals for compressing and uncompressing image information. the interesting thing bieng how it was possible to take a fuzzy virtualy unrecognizable image and apply a fractal application to it and resolve the fuzzy image into a clear recognizable image. extrapolating as it were with fractals to in a sense predict what something is.
here's some more specific information:

in the video links above part 5 of 6 ((Dead link: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ajdog...eature=related)) it shows how Bosley's fractal analyzer
can take a highly pixelated image (one that is distorted because of magnification) and restore that image to it's non-distorted state while retaining the expanded size. additionally further expansion of any part of the fractally treated image is not distorted.
the claim they make is that this process is a prediction from the information contained in the less precise image that is able to yield (through the use of fractals) a more precise image.
 

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sagefr0g

Well-Known Member
Kasi said:
...
Of course, to make $40 with 250 unhits or whatever might as well go voodoo all the way and play some even money game that will win you that unit 99% of the time lol.
....
i finally tryed two of those even money games the other night for the first time ever.
i had won $35 playing blackjack eight deck s17 das 6/8pen at this one joint.
went to another joint and played a video roulette game by i think it's Balley's :confused:. first time i'd ever played roulette. won $5 .
played the electronic blackjack game we've all been talking about (got the hot lookin dealer) but you can't tell when it shuffles. won $14 .
won $3 on a penny slot machine. didn't play any blackjack at that joint as didn't feel like messing with the variance or i was scared or what ever :p.
stopped at this one last joint that usually has table mins above what i prefer.
they had a $5 csm table that i thought i'd try out some fuzzy betting on. lol. i ended up losing two hundred bucks. :eek:
so i've been wanting to try out craps and i had fooled with that electronic roulette machine. so i thought well i'll try some table roulette. fooled around betting the red, black, odd, even bets and some on that third of the field stuff that pays 2:1. well any way a long story short i mixed up my betting trying out the fuzzy bet stuff as however it struck my fancy. ended up finally winning $100.
it was late as hell and i was kind of tired but i still wanted that other hundred back. lol. and i'd been wanting to try craps even though i haven't the foggiest of how your supposed to play it. i just knew you could make a pass line bet is about it and hope for the thrower to make the point sort of thing. i had to ask one of the guys playing how to even place my bet and even when i was allowed to and all. he showed me how to lay odds on the pass line bet if i wanted to. and then i mimiced how another guy was placing 6 & 8 bets.
what ever i heard those are almost fair bets. so i got in trouble once for putting down a bet when a guy was in the process of throwing the dice. then i got in trouble when i was throwing the dice cause i picked them up with one hand and put them in the other lmao. supposed to just use one hand. i threw one of the dice to where it bounced completely off the table lmao. i guess those guys were thinkin where the hell'd this a$$hole come from? :laugh: but every one was pretty ok with me, i guess cause i was rollin pretty many 7's on the come out roll and makin pretty many points. so but it was pretty cool how i guess a pretty good streak of points was being made and sevens on the come out roll and i got up $50. then a couple or three points were not made in a row and my winnings dwindled. a bunch of the guys left the table at that point. i started fuzzy betting some at that point and was at the table alone for a while. things started turning around and my bank built back up so i went back to betting a lower unit and laying a few pass line odds. then another bunch jumped on the table. i guess they thought it was hot. and i guess it was cause i got my hundred bucks back. took the loot and ran.
i guess this is some bad voodoo and all but it sure was fun. :devil::whip:
 
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