The cost of playing blackjack

[PokerJunky]

Always tip, maybe too much, but it makes my stay more pleasant especially if you're going to be in the same casino for a few days.

Also when calculating your expenses keep in mind the opportunity cost. If you weren't playing BJ, you still would be eating/drinking, etc... I calculate the incremental costs from going on my trip. If I was not in the casino, I'd usually be spending my money on something else. On the other hand, if you're going to the casino in place of your regualar job, then by all means include all costs.

 

[shadroch]

Absolutely.
Compare a week in Vegas to a week in Orlando.
room in Vegas-$0 Orlando-$125 a day
meals in Vegas -$0 Orlando $70 a day.
entertainment- Vegas $0 Orlando- a park pass is over $55 a day.
Only thing Orlando has in favor is the airfare is about 25% less from NYC.

 

[ChefJJ]

I'm a red chipper for the most part too...but tips are a regular part of my game. EV, whatever. Geez, if I won $500 and didn't tip anything, I'd kick my own ass. You're telling me you can't even put down a buck here and there to play for the dealers? That's just sick. Sorry to rant on another poster on this site, but that's the way it is.

The thread is called "The Cost of Playing Blackjack", and as in many other businesses, there is a cost of doing business. And taking care of people is what makes many people successful...and often not just for "an edge" either. My point: if you are too stingy to throw a dollar or two, why are you gambling?

 

[jetace]

If you want to tip, a good way to keep it under control is to tip only on naturals. If you're getting your naturals, you're making your money, and you can easily calculate how much of your EV you are tipping. Furthermore, the dealer knows there is nothing he or she can do to increase the number of naturals you get but to deal faster. When the dealer deals faster your EV per hour increases, no doubt about it.

If you believe it is wrong to not tip, by all means tip. Never do something that is against your beliefs for money. I can live without that $1 cheque more easily than I can live without my principles. But it's easy to get carried away, especially during periods of very good variance where it seems everything is going your way and the stacks of green and black in front of you make it easy to toke red. But EV is EV and guaranteed when you see the ass end of variance, you'll wish you had some of those tokes back.

That's what I've always done Monkey. I just tip when I get the "change" from a blackjack. My min. bet is $5 so I save the $2.50 for tips. When I have a larger bet out like $25, I still only use the $2.50 change for tips. That way my EV really isn't affected too adversely. Usually I'll save one of those for the cocktail waitress tips as well. If I'm hitting a ton of blackjacks, I'll use the stack of pennies for a min bet, and then use the .50 pieces for the tips.

 

[Automatic Monkey]

I'm a red chipper for the most part too...but tips are a regular part of my game. EV, whatever. Geez, if I won $500 and didn't tip anything, I'd kick my own ass. You're telling me you can't even put down a buck here and there to play for the dealers? That's just sick. Sorry to rant on another poster on this site, but that's the way it is.

Well now if you are a red chipper, it takes you 20-60 hours to earn (not win) $500, depending on the game and conditions. If you win $500 in a few hours, which I'm sure you have done many times, that's luck, not earnings. EV is all I play for and it's important not to be blinded by variance, either good or bad.

The thread is called "The Cost of Playing Blackjack", and as in many other businesses, there is a cost of doing business. And taking care of people is what makes many people successful...and often not just for "an edge" either. My point: if you are too stingy to throw a dollar or two, why are you gambling?

I don't gamble. My intent is not to throw away any dollars. But I do believe anybody working for me should be paid by me, so I tip a minimal amount.

 

[21forme]

Is blackjack the way you make or supplement your living, or do you just do it for fun (or the challenge or a hobby)?

If the latter, do costs really matter? Suppose you were golfing or fishing. Do you consider the costs in those cases? Always -EV.

Obviously if you make your living this way, it's a different game and costs matter (and get deducted from your taxes as business expenses.)

For me, it's just the fun and challenge of getting better at it, so I don't look at the costs, which are pretty small, anyway. I live a 90 minute drive from AC. The comps for incidentals (food, etc.) build up faster than I use them, and I either make a day trip of it or take a comped room.

 

[ScottH]

I've never been in a casino where you could use your comps to leave a tip.
I really don't understand your posts. In one you say you work in the service industry and understand tipping,then you imply that you don't tip at all. Or am I misreading " I have never.... If I can't get it for free,ect,ect"....
Not tipping a dealer is bad enough,but if you don't tip your waitresses or the servers because you got a "free meal",you are wrong,plain and simple.
You are young,and inexperianced,but thats really not an excuse.Service people in the casino industry depend on tips. People who stiff them should examine their food and beverages very closely.

I said I do tip in the restaurants. I can get 10 dollars in "cash" for the restaurant. So if I change comps for 10 dollars at the restaurant and the bill is 7 dollars I can leave the 10, and 3 is the tip. But it did not come from my cash, it came from my comps.

Yes I work in the service industry, I have for 7 years. Some people tip, some people dont, GET OVER IT ALREADY! If I dont get tipped I dont go in the back and bitch about it to all the coworkers, some people just dont tip much, i dont give a crap. I don't go spit in people's food because it's not required that anyone tip.

Hey Shadroch, what's 15% of FREE? NOTHING! :laugh:

 

[ScottH]

My point: if you are too stingy to throw a dollar or two, why are you gambling?

I'm not gambling, I'm working!

 

[ScottH]

In case you all didnt realize, I am an ethical egoist. I only do what is best for me. Tipping is -EV, unless I think I can get more than what I put in.

I do tip at restaurants, free meal or not. But I don't tip dealers. I just dont feel like giving away any money to anyone involved in a casino. That's just me though.

 

[ScottH]

You're telling me you can't even put down a buck here and there to play for the dealers? That's just sick.

OK, here's the deal people. The dealer asks me nicely to tip a percentage of my wins. That's fine. I would IF they gave me a percentage of my LOSSES BACK! They want me to give them money because they "helped" me win, but they won't do shit for me when I lose! Because if they think they are entitled to a percent of my wins because they dealt the cards, then they are responsible for my losses, and I've never seen a dealer tip a player after they wiped them out of chips.

 

[supercoolmancool]

I use to never tip even at restaurants. But after getting chewed out by family and freinds I now tip a flat $2.00.

 

[shadroch]

I said I do tip in the restaurants. I can get 10 dollars in "cash" for the restaurant. So if I change comps for 10 dollars at the restaurant and the bill is 7 dollars I can leave the 10, and 3 is the tip. But it did not come from my cash, it came from my comps.

Yes I work in the service industry, I have for 7 years. Some people tip, some people dont, GET OVER IT ALREADY! If I dont get tipped I dont go in the back and bitch about it to all the coworkers, some people just dont tip much, i dont give a crap. I don't go spit in people's food because it's not required that anyone tip.

Hey Shadroch, what's 15% of FREE? NOTHING! :laugh:

Scott,
I'd be very surprised if your comp could be used for a tip.No casino I've ever played in allows that.Perhaps you play in one that does,but that is not the industry standard. I'm getting the overall impression that all you really care about is yourself
Just so you know,in the off chance no one has ever told you,when enjoying a comped meal it is normal to tip as if you were paying for it.Or more.
When we eat at a nice steakhouse,for example,$20 a person is the average.

 

[ScottH]

Scott,
I'd be very surprised if your comp could be used for a tip.No casino I've ever played in allows that.Perhaps you play in one that does,but that is not the industry standard. I'm getting the overall impression that all you really care about is yourself
Just so you know,in the off chance no one has ever told you,when enjoying a comped meal it is normal to tip as if you were paying for it.Or more.
When we eat at a nice steakhouse,for example,$20 a person is the average.

I do tip just as if the meal were not free. Say the bill is 20 dollars, and I get it free, I would leave 3 dollars for a tip. The only thing is, that 3 dollars I got came from cashable comps. Get it?

So if you want to feel better about it, I'll say I tip with my own money, and use the cashable comps as my profit. Does that give you inner peace? Either way you look at it, the server gets their money. Ok?

 

[shadroch]

You play in a casino that gives you cashable comps for playing BJ?
Where is this? I'm serious,I know of only one local casino in Nevada that gives cash for playing BJ?

 

[ScottH]

You play in a casino that gives you cashable comps for playing BJ?
Where is this? I'm serious,I know of only one local casino in Nevada that gives cash for playing BJ?

Yeah, cashable comps for playing any game. They also have a nice double deck game with 90% penetration! No joke. But they watch it like a hawk of course, and it is the only double deck table in the entire casino, so you can't move around.

It's not in Nevada, you already know I don't play there.

 

[shadroch]

Is it in Fargo?

 

[ScottH]

Is it in Fargo?

Nope, it is about 1.5 hours from Fargo. It was my second home last summer, for obvious reasons!

That's the casino I was forced to burn myself out playing because there are literally no casinos around it. So to relate to this thread, to keep my EV above "the cost of playing blackjack'' I had to play long sessions to make any money. With only 4 tables in the "high stakes" room, I could not go unnoticed for the entire summer, but I came really close to getting through the summer without getting backed off. I'll be back next summer, however.

I wish it were in Fargo. If it were I would still be playing there, blending in with the ploppies...

 

[ChefJJ]

Well now if you are a red chipper, it takes you 20-60 hours to earn (not win) $500, depending on the game and conditions. If you win $500 in a few hours, which I'm sure you have done many times, that's luck, not earnings. EV is all I play for and it's important not to be blinded by variance, either good or bad.



I don't gamble. My intent is not to throw away any dollars. But I do believe anybody working for me should be paid by me, so I tip a minimal amount.

When I made the comment about winning $500, it was because someone else said that. I've never won $500 betting red chips in 2 hours. Unfortunately

 

[ScottH]

When I made the comment about winning $500, it was because someone else said that. I've never won $500 betting red chips in 2 hours. Unfortunately

I made more than 500! I sure wish I could find another promo like that again...

 

[Automatic Monkey]

OK, here's the deal people. The dealer asks me nicely to tip a percentage of my wins. That's fine. I would IF they gave me a percentage of my LOSSES BACK! They want me to give them money because they "helped" me win, but they won't do shit for me when I lose! Because if they think they are entitled to a percent of my wins because they dealt the cards, then they are responsible for my losses, and I've never seen a dealer tip a player after they wiped them out of chips.

When I tip, there's always something I ask for in return. "Is it OK if you deal a little faster?" or "Can you show me the burn card?" Rarely do they say 'no'. What I'm doing in this case is making the dealer my partner- they are helping me take extra money from the casino and I am splitting it with them.

Conversely, if you are not tipping and you ask the dealer to deal faster, they might deal slower. At the green chip level or higher it is possible for tipping to be +EV.