Real Pros?

[Xenophon]

Arnold Snyders' BJFO

I think Blackbelt in Blackjack is one of the best books ever written on the game of blackjack.

This is a great thread. I've been reading everything I can pertaining to blackjack for a long time. I too, think that Blackbelt in Blackjack is one of the best books ever written about blackjack advantage play. In my opinion, one of the counts Arnold developed is specifically engineered for a certain type of play beyond counting. When he suggests that count be used in a specific manner, he is silently but emphatically communicating that it is the perfect fit, and even more, for that type of advantage play.

If you read the articles in the library on BJFO, you get a sense for what it takes to become a real professional. The information is not spoon-fed to the readers, it is clearly stated that one has to read everything presented, get out there, do things, and be flexible. Professionals do not get to where they are by following the herd, they develop unique things that casinos are not looking for, or do the opposite of what the casinos are looking for, right under their nose.

This all being said, I've thoroughly enjoyed the information pertaining to advantage play that Craps Master has alluded to. If you want to be a true professional, you have to get out there and do it, and do it differently than almost everyone else, and not tell everyone what you're doing.

 

[sagefr0g]

.............
I just wish I could find this 6-5 advantage post Sonny mentioned. Can someone pm me with it,please.

ditto

 

[Craps Master]

Anyone here knows that I do not "plug" the consolidation-gambit betting. Notwithstanding, when Grosjean chose to "plug" it in Beyond Counting he could have given due credit.

To whom? Surely not you, because people were aware of consolidation betting long before you ever played a hand of blackjack. Or did you want to go ahead and make the claim that you invented the (relatively useless) idea of consolidation betting?

Your ad hominen denouncement of my "untrustworthiness" gives me a chuckle since you choose not to share your identy or finer details of your credentials, whereas I, the untrustworthy one, have shared most everything about myself.

You've served time on account of your untrustworthiness, haven't you? You call yourself "The Grifter" or "zengrifter." For anyone who knows what a grifter is, it should come as no surprise that you're not a trustworthy fellow and, on top of that, you proudly link to articles that talk about how you're a scammer. You practically advertise the fact that no one should trust you in neon lights; that is hardly ad hominem, merely a statement of fact.

So, here and now, tell us who or what you are, without actual identity of course. What do you do and how long have you been doing it, and especially, how much have you made doing it? We are all ears!

Does it bother you so much to not know my name? To not be able to pinpoint my writing style or figure out who in the community I might be? It doesn't really matter, does it? The merit of my words stands on its own, without need for a name or resumé to back them up. Of course you're dubious, because wolves see wolves, and you are surely one about whom anyone and everyone should be skeptical. Truth is, I'm just a guy who has made his living finding an edge at the tables for years.

And, while you are at it, tell us again why you are here... is it out of compassion for our ignorance? zg

I'm sure you wouldn't understand. Simply put, you are not of a sophisticated enough mentality to understand what makes a guy like me tick. If you want to say I'm here out of compassion for your ignorance, that's fine by me.

All that said, I think it's time you take your leave from this thread, because, again, it's about Real Pros not faux grifters. If you have questions for me about the game of blackjack, perhaps I will deign to answer them.

 

[Craps Master]

Did we ever locate the 6/5 advantage ploy? zg

ditto

Look harder. It's there in a post. If you can't even find that, you have no hope of actually being able to pull the technique off in a casino.

 

[zengrifter]

Look harder. It's there in a post. If you can't even find that, you have no hope of actually being able to pull the technique off in a casino.

SageFrog, you have your marching orders, macshnell! zg(waiting)

 

[shadroch]

Are we talking about Read the Dealer,by Steve Forte?

 

[Craps Master]

Are we talking about Read the Dealer,by Steve Forte?

No. I would definitely advise against trying this method to beat 6:5 games.

 

[shadroch]

How about his other book on Game Protection?

 

[zengrifter]

To whom? Surely not you, because people were aware of consolidation betting long before you ever played a hand of blackjack.

What year might that have been?

Or did you want to go ahead and make the claim that you invented the (relatively useless) idea of consolidation betting?

I make only the claims for it that are ascribed in my interview. It is only relatively useless in the sense that card-counting is relatively useless to you, supposedly.

You've served time on account of your untrustworthiness, haven't you? You call yourself "The Grifter" or "zengrifter." For anyone who knows what a grifter is, it should come as no surprise that you're not a trustworthy fellow and, on top of that, you proudly link to articles that talk about how you're a scammer.

I am satisfied with the level of integrity with which my interview explores the nature of my case and conviction, as well as the origin of my 'Grifter' monicker.

As for proudly linking. The article(s) in question are a poor and incomplete description of what really happened. Afterall, Forbes says I was looking at life for $200M+ in fraud, but instead got only 20 years.

The reality is much more accurately reviewed in the interview - 14 months and NO RESTITUTION as evidenced by my presence here.

And, YOU KNOW that I've made others rich in cellular and wireless speculation because its been documented for you to see.

So your instistence on instead spreading rumors and half-truths underscores your lack of sincerity, as well as your refusal to let me post in Fight Club. While accussing me of trolling for 'marks' there, which is ludicrous and leaves you without credibility.

You practically advertise the fact that no one should trust you in neon lights; that is hardly ad hominem, merely a statement of fact.

Well, I'm not sure who trusts who, BUT we can have another poll, I suppose.

Does it bother you so much to not know my name? To not be able to pinpoint my writing style or figure out who in the community I might be? It doesn't really matter, does it? The merit of my words stands on its own, without need for a name or resumé to back them up. Of course you're dubious, because wolves see wolves...

I don't need to know your name, but I know who you are, and I beleive the expression that you were searching for is an old ZEN proverb: "When two theives meet, no introduction is necessary."

I'm sure you wouldn't understand. Simply put, you are not of a sophisticated enough mentality to understand what makes a guy like me tick. If you want to say I'm here out of compassion for your ignorance, that's fine by me.

Okay doll!:laugh:

All that said, I think it's time you take your leave from this thread, because, again, it's about Real Pros not faux grifters. If you have questions for me about the game of blackjack, perhaps I will deign to answer them.

Okay, deal... lets keep the deal... ahh, except, you are saying that I'm a FAUX grifter?:sad: Not the real thing?

$270M in securities fraud-racketeering and $600M in FCC rights and NO RESTITUTION and I'm only a FAUX grifter!?!?

Well FAUX YOU (ma'am). zg

 

[zengrifter]

SageF, don't give up, we'll get to the bottom of this yet! zg

 

[Craps Master]

How about his other book on Game Protection?

Yes, it's an excellent book. Maybe you could find a few methods to beat 6:5 in there. And a few of them may even be legal!

 

[Craps Master]

What year might that have been?

1971.

I make only the claims for it that are ascribed in my interview. It is only relatively useless in the sense that card-counting is relatively useless to you, supposedly.

It is relatively useless to anyone who knows how to intelligently evaluate conditions and exploit the best games. I think your ability to do such is right at that of a hobbyist or amateur. Professionals use tactics that garner results beyond that which your little Grifter's Gambit does. I'll grant you that it's cute, but it doesn't really get the money in any meaningful sense.

I am satisfied with the level of integrity with which my interview explores the nature of my case and conviction, as well as the origin of my 'Grifter' monicker.

Why must you insult me and the readers of this thread with links to interviews of you conducted by Barfarkel. You want to maybe link me to other places where more non-professionals talk about you and ask you questions? Because, you know, I was just sitting here thinking about how much I really want to get some amateur-level information, and some philosophically unsound lectures on ethics and integrity from a guy who calls himself "The Grifter."

As for proudly linking. The article(s) in question are a poor and incomplete description of what really happened.

I'm sure they are, zengrifter; I'm sure they are. But you're fooling yourself if you think I'm going to follow any of these links and read about you. Everything I need to know about you has been said. You said it yourself:

As for me, Stalker likes to point out that he's "only" seen me play reds, and its true - the two times I recall encountering him I was playing reds.

First of all, my INTERVIEW makes it clear that I'm not a full-time pro, but that I have tried counting full time on a few occaisions when I had nothing better going on. And in the case of the illustrious Stalker sightings, during the period that I was approaching sentencing, my BR was quite limited or so it would seem. So I shouldn't play?

So you're not a Real Pro, and yet you continue to attempt to bury us amidst an avalanche of irrelevant verbiage in this thread about Real Pros. You're not a Real Pro and, from where I'm sitting, your opinion is worth about -->.<-- that much.

So your instistence on instead spreading rumors and half-truths underscores your lack of sincerity, as well as your refusal to let me post in Fight Club. While accussing me of trolling for 'marks' there, which is ludicrous and leaves you without credibility.

I don't have anything to do with Fight Club, guy. Maybe this will eventually sink in. I don't care for those forums because I don't care for their forum software. If they would upgrade to something like vBulletin, then maybe you'd see me over there. Until then, no thanks. So, guess again.

I don't need to know your name, but I know who you are, and I beleive the expression that you were searching for is an old ZEN proverb: "When two theives meet, no introduction is necessary."

Is this your roundabout way of saying you and QFIT didn't require an introduction? Isn't that sweet. You guys, thick as thieves, getting along so well. As for who I am... I don't think you have it in you to learn, especially since you're so dead-set on thinking I'm someone else. And, it ultimately doesn't matter anyway.

Okay, deal... lets keep the deal... ahh, except, you are saying that I'm a FAUX grifter?:sad: Not the real thing?

$270M in securities fraud-racketeering and $600M in FCC rights and NO RESTITUTION and I'm only a FAUX grifter!?!?

That's right. A faux grifter. A talented grifter would be able to scrape together enough to bet something more than red chips.

 

[zengrifter]

1971.

OH, I was in high-school.

It is relatively useless to anyone who knows how to intelligently evaluate conditions and exploit the best games. I think your ability to do such is right at that of a hobbyist or amateur. Professionals use tactics that garner results beyond that which your little Grifter's Gambit does. I'll grant you that it's cute, but it doesn't really get the money in any meaningful sense.

We've already conceded that card-counting is weak compared to holecarding and other lesser known APs. But don't forget that this is a card-counting site.

Why must you insult me and the readers of this thread with links to interviews of you conducted by Barfarkel. You want to maybe link me to other places where more non-professionals talk about you and ask you questions? Because, you know, I was just sitting here thinking about how much I really want to get some amateur-level information, and some philosophically unsound lectures on ethics and integrity from a guy who calls himself "The Grifter."

The links weren't for you, darling.

But you're fooling yourself if you think I'm going to follow any of these links and read about you. Everything I need to know about you has been said. You said it yourself:

yes, and I'll say it again, the links weren't for you, my dear.

So you're not a Real Pro, and yet you continue to attempt to bury us amidst an avalanche of irrelevant verbiage in this thread about Real Pros. You're not a Real Pro and, from where I'm sitting, your opinion is worth about -->.<-- that much.

Hey, I thought we had a deal.

I don't have anything to do with Fight Club, guy. Maybe this will eventually sink in. I don't care for those forums because I don't care for their forum software. If they would upgrade to something like vBulletin, then maybe you'd see me over there. Until then, no thanks. So, guess again.

OOOH TAAY, as Buckwheat would say.

Is this your roundabout way of saying you and QFIT didn't require an introduction? Isn't that sweet. You guys, thick as thieves, getting along so well. As for who I am... I don't think you have it in you to learn, especially since you're so dead-set on thinking I'm someone else. And, it ultimately doesn't matter anyway.

Oh well, I guess we both think that the other is 'someone else'.

That's right. A faux grifter. A talented grifter would be able to scrape together enough to bet something more than red chips.

How little you know, after all. Hey, now stop it! We made a deal - I can ask you BJ questions. I'm not a TRUE professional AP - no one at this site is confused about that.

So, we can now have non-adversarial communication, yes?

Fondly, zg

 

[Craps Master]

We've already conceded that card-counting is weak compared to holecarding and other lesser known APs. But don't forget that this is a card-counting site.

Yeah, I was talking about card counting, jack. Professional-level card counting that doesn't involve red chips or "Grifter's Gambit." Maybe you weren't aware that the most important part of a card counters game is accurately and honestly evaluating conditions? In fact, it is this little aspect that separates the amateurs from the professionals, and it all comes from patience and maintaining a rational mindset at all times when on the job. Well, there you go, you've learned something new. Free of charge, courtesy of Craps Master. You're welcome.

So, we can now have non-adversarial communication, yes?

Yes, now that we've established where we all stand, sure, feel free to make use of this thread as an amateur and ask a Real Pro some questions. I can't promise I'll answer you, but maybe I will.

 

[zengrifter]

Yeah, I was talking about card counting, jack. Professional-level card counting that doesn't involve red chips or "Grifter's Gambit." Maybe you weren't aware that the most important part of a card counters game is accurately and honestly evaluating conditions? In fact, it is this little aspect that separates the amateurs from the professionals, and it all comes from patience and maintaining a rational mindset at all times when on the job. Well, there you go, you've learned something new. Free of charge, courtesy of Craps Master. You're welcome.

It will take awhile for that one to sink in.

Yes, now that we've established where we all stand, sure, feel free to make use of this thread as an amateur and ask a Real Pro some questions. I can't promise I'll answer you, but maybe I will.

OK, my sweet, here's two questions: What are the best current opportunities in casinos for AP that you feel at liberty to mention? And, what value does card-counting, if any, have for today? zg

 

[Craps Master]

OK, here's two questions: What are the best current opportunities in casinos for AP that you feel at liberty to mention? And, what value does card-counting, if any, have for today? zg

Card counters are still taking untold millions out of casinos every year. The best opportunities strictly depend on your bankroll, of course, but I'd say card counting is still very solid, so long as you're willing to do what it takes to be competent at it, and exploitation of comps, deposit bonuses, and loss rebates are good opportunities for people with a good standing in the industry and access to a very large bankroll.

When I talk about competent card counting, I mean spreading very aggressively in houses where your action will go unnoticed. I don't really understand why neophyte counters aren't swarming the rug joints in Las Vegas and taking on their 6-deck shoes. You can get away with spreads on the order of 1 to 3 x 30 or more and go completely unnoticed, so long as you make your play when there are other bettors around whose action far eclipses yours. If you can pull this off, why screw around with the shitty double decks? So many counters lack the patience or confidence to play shoes and play them extremely aggressively. Those counters either don't last or don't get anywhere in the industry.

Looking for alternative advantage play opportunities is always great, but the specialized knowledge and skill required for such can be beyond the scope of what a lot of people want to put in and, in some cases, simply not possible for them to pull off consistently. A disciplined, fearless counter can still destroy casinos from Las Vegas to Atlantic city to everywhere between and beyond, and will probably be able to for a very long time. It requires ignoring bad, timid advice such as conservative bet ramps, small spreads and overly-expensive camouflage, and instead pressing your edges to the limit of your chosen level of RoR as dictated by your bankroll everytime they come up.

If you're not playing good shoes with at least a 1 to 2 x 20 spread (and preferably bigger), you're wasting your time. If you must play double decks, at least be selective and try for no less than a 1 to 2 x 15 spread.

 

[QFIT]

He is here for the same reason any of us are,because we choose to be.
Before QFIT attacked him three or four posts into this thread,he was making some very valid points.

Whoa; I made some general comments about people that claim they are the "real pros" in answer to the original post. And I stand by them and think they are self-evident. CM started the attacks with

LOL, it took you ten minutes to compose this post? Impressive.

You don't know how to play cards professionally. You've never sequenced, you've never played against a flasher, you've never spooked, you've never caught the next card, you've never steered, and, from everything I've heard, you count cards for red chips. I'm sure your information will be about as damaging to the professional community and as groundbreaking as Mason Malmuth's chapter on frontloading in Blackjack Essays.
...

CM replies with a string of lies. Not good points. CM logic consists of false declarative statements.

 

[Craps Master]

CM replies with a string of lies. Not good points. CM logic consists of false declarative statements.

You're not a Real Pro, and you admit to having no expertise in the realm of blackjack. I still think your software is a waste of time and money for professionals and aspiring professionals. You keep trying to resort to effete rhetoric to bail you out. It's not going to work.

So, having established that you're not a real professional and you have no expertise in the game of blackjack, are there any tips you would like to ask me, a Real Pro with a wide array of expertise, here in this thread devoted to inquiring about Real Pros and their specialized information? If not, maybe you could make your exit from this thread and go talk about how 13 people think your software is great or how you're not an expert player in some other thread, because we're all past that now.

You're welcome in advance.

 

[QFIT]

you admit to having no expertise in the realm of blackjack.

That is the fourth time you have repeated this lie. I admitted to no such thing. After your attack where you claimed I constantly call myself an expert; I said that I never call myself an expert. That's simply my style. My three sites contain about 150 pages. Nowhere in those pages do I make any claims at all about myself. The fact that I do not constantly make self-aggrandizing claims as seen in your posts does not mean that I claim to know nothing. Some people earn their reputations and others simply make claims about themselves and others with zero evidence.

 

[EasyRhino]

If you must play double decks, at least be selective and try for no less than a 1 to 2 x 15 spread.

I want my Mommy.