The Straw That Broke the Camels Back

[bjo32]

Excellent post Rattle1! I wasn’t going to weigh in on this topic since it’s such a ridicules claim (for all the reasons you’ve already mentioned) that I can’t believe any intelligent person believes it.

“Beast Mode” is one of the more amusing things APs have come up with. The funny thing is there are some APs that actually think they have exploited it. I don’t know who are dumber, the APs that believe in “beast mode” or the ones who think they have exploited it. Lol.

I’ve also had a debate with KewJ on Mindplay, which I won’t get into here. But it’s much more complicated than what KewlJ and other APs believe. This technology went by the wayside because it was flawed and the casino staff and public didn’t like it. It’s not because it was designed to be a cheating device.

As far as casinos and cheating, does it go on? Of course. There are about 500 casinos in USA. It would be ridicules to think someone somewhere in the casino industry hasn’t cheated at sometime now or in the past. What people like to do is point out some isolated case of cheating here or there and then indict a whole industry of doing it all the time. These same people do the same thing with busisness. They point out one or two corrupt businesses (think Enron and Worldcom) and claim this shows all business cheat and are corrupt.

It’s good to see a like-minded AP who has some common sense.

 

[KewlJ]

Rattler, I tried to treat you like an adult and respectfully answer some of your questions (those that I could) and you shit all over me, posting an entire post full of lies and assumptions, zero of which had an ounce of truth to them.

So we are done, which should have been my initial response. Play your trolling games with someone else.

 

[psyduck]

KJ, because of your "false" claim, now the government is going to shut down and the stock market is dropping like a rock and the politicians started to lie and a recession is right around the corner.......................... All your fault!

 

[ZenKinG]

By the way, I just want to clarify that I am not just trying to be a sarcastic jerk in the above post. I really am thankful that you chose to provide some clarification and I really would buy you a gift certificate to your favorite Vegas restaurant if it turns out you're being honest and accurate.

My post above was just my best stab at taking all of the info that you have posted on various forums and compiling it into a narrative that could possibly make sense in the real world.

And whats your opinion about pre shuffled cards without a state inspected GLI compliant ASM to verify the cards? Are you ok with that? Turns out, gaming is not verifying these cards at ANY POINT in time. The dealer isnt verifying them, the shift manager isnt verifying them, the floormen arent verifying them, the only ones verifying them is some card manufacturer in China or wherever the hell they come from as well as the high end casino executives who inspect them in the 'back' to make sure theyre not getting screwed.

Who is to say the higher up casino executives dont pull out any aces or 10s prior to play?

 

[BoSox]

ZenKinG, is right on the money, there is no longer reliable game protection. Integrity is not considered a word associated with casino games anymore.

 

[BoSox]

Also whoever mentioned 'free speech', i think it was KJ, i hope you and everyone else in society realize free speech only applies with you vs the governmemt. Theres no general free speech rights. If an employer or site manager doesnt want you to say something they have every right to silence you.

You sure got that right when the cards are stacked against you from the get-go why even bother trying to make a point with someone who uses selective memory favorites. Thank goodness for a site like this one, which allows for some independent leeway.

 

[Dummy]

And whats your opinion about pre shuffled cards without a state inspected GLI compliant ASM to verify the cards? Are you ok with that? Turns out, gaming is not verifying these cards at ANY POINT in time. The dealer isnt verifying them, the shift manager isnt verifying them, the floormen arent verifying them, the only ones verifying them is some card manufacturer in China or wherever the hell they come from as well as the high end casino executives who inspect them in the 'back' to make sure theyre not getting screwed.

I can't get a hand shuffle on the first deal of one of these packs because the shuffle machine has to verify all the cards are there.

 

[BoSox]

1. You bought a Deckmate 2 on Ebay or something. This Deckmate 2 (which does have card recognition capability), has a secret mode that a tech-savvy individual can opt into.

KJ did not say that there was a secret mode built into the machines period. What you are saying above would make the manufacturer of that machine guilty which was just the opposite of what he stated.

2. El Cortez heard about these accusations and immediately swapped out their Deckmate 2's with Deckmate 1 (which doesn't have card recognition so the machine isn't capable of this sorting).

KJ, said that he can prove this with other AP who live in LV who saw this for themselves. Of course, he owes you nothing.

3. The big independent labs that verify all of the software, such as GLI, either somehow missed this secret mode that you and your AP buddy found so quickly.

Your facts are again incorrect to what he actually said.

4. Certain pit bosses are aware of this mode, and when Joe Card Counter comes along... he starts betting $25. A few minutes later at the end of a double deck shoe, Joe is throwing out $500 bets, then at the shuffle starts betting $25 again. The pit boss casually walks over, asks Joe Card Counter how he is doing and flips on "beast mode."

Sorry your facts on mode are off again.

5. The pit bosses/ surveillance/ others involved in casino operations, many of whom play and count cards in other casinos, choose to keep their mouths shut about this, because they are the most loyal group of people on the planet.

KJ spoke about only one specific casino a very small one at that. Who is to say that the machines did not work the same way 24 hours a day slowly grinding a slightly higher casino edge without any conceivable notice by MOST anyone.

6. You don't take videos of the process and post them anonymously on YouTube. You don't share your data regarding the high true counts. You don't even hang onto the unit as proof. You don't pass this along to some litigious individual who would love to go to bat with this against greedy cheating corporations. You sell it on Ebay to someone who lives overseas and we are all left without a shred of proof... just vague claims made on internet blackjack forums by a stranger.

KJ, was only trying to find out answers to questions where he had previous doubts on possible cheating taking place, that's it. He spoke about it briefly on two forums that I know of warning players of the possibilities and to make their own judgments. What more was he supposed to do? Plenty according to you, but you are not him.

The beast mode was a term another poster "who has not posted in this thread" used that others picked up on. The way the beast mode could only come into play according to the way KJ explained it is if the actual machines are tampered and altered with after leaving the factory.

 

[xengrifter]

I really don't even understand why some players are so obsessed with variance and reducing variance. Variance is our friend. Without variance, everyone and their brother would just roll along accumulating EV on a regular basis with no swings and the result would be the casino industry simply would no longer be able to offer such games. Variance and what it does to most players makes the game as we know it....possible.

Learn to handle and deal with variance and you have learned the discipline necessary to win playing blackjack. It is that simple, just ask Zee or ZK or I guess anyone with a "z" handle.

You are such a salamander!

 

[KewlJ]

You are such a salamander!

And proud of it! 15 years now.

 

[BoSox]

Excellent post Rattle1! I wasn’t going to weigh in on this topic since it’s such a ridicules claim (for all the reasons you’ve already mentioned) that I can’t believe any intelligent person believes it.

“Beast Mode” is one of the more amusing things APs have come up with. The funny thing is there are some APs that actually think they have exploited it. I don’t know who are dumber, the APs that believe in “beast mode” or the ones who think they have exploited it. Lol.

I’ve also had a debate with KewJ on Mindplay, which I won’t get into here. But it’s much more complicated than what KewlJ and other APs believe. This technology went by the wayside because it was flawed and the casino staff and public didn’t like it. It’s not because it was designed to be a cheating device.

As far as casinos and cheating, does it go on? Of course. There are about 500 casinos in USA. It would be ridicules to think someone somewhere in the casino industry hasn’t cheated at sometime now or in the past. What people like to do is point out some isolated case of cheating here or there and then indict a whole industry of doing it all the time. These same people do the same thing with busisness. They point out one or two corrupt businesses (think Enron and Worldcom) and claim this shows all business cheat and are corrupt.

It’s good to see a like-minded AP who has some common sense.

Dbs6582/ bjo32, it is one thing to get yourself involved near the end of a heated debate while using your known handle and do your own bashing/criticizing while taking sides, fine if you feel that strongly about it. However, doing that under an alias while helping attempt to drag down others that you regularly posts back and forth with on other boards is disgusting, to say the least.

 

[bjo32]

Dbs6582/ bjo32, it is one thing to get yourself involved near the end of a heated debate while using your known handle and do your own bashing/criticizing while taking sides, fine if you feel that strongly about it. However, doing that under an alias while helping attempt to drag down others that you regularly posts back and forth with on other boards is disgusting, to say the least.

Bosox, you’re a piece of work. I don’t know what you’re talking about. I’m very consistent. There is nothing I say I don’t believe, although I say things with some sacrasim. I have never taken two sides of a debate. I know what I believe.

I don’t understand why having a different handle on two different forums means anything. To me this is like having two different passwords to sign into two different accounts. I do this all the time. I didn’t know it was an AP thing to do to have the same handle on different forums. I don’t look at my handle as meaning much more than allowing me to post. I now see in the AP world, a handle means a lot. I doubt if the average Joe poster knows this. APs have their own set of weird rules that only other APs understand.

 

[BoSox]

bjo32, on one hand, "while using other handles" you compliment a smart poster on other boards while saying that you learned something new. Then you appear at this board with a new handle and enter a reply in post #91 with the following:

"
Excellent post Rattle1! I wasn’t going to weigh in on this topic since it’s such a ridicules claim (for all the reasons you’ve already mentioned) that I can’t believe any intelligent person believes it.

“Beast Mode” is one of the more amusing things APs have come up with. The funny thing is there are some APs that actually think they have exploited it. I don’t know who are dumber, the APs that believe in “beast mode” or the ones who think they have exploited it. Lol."

Of course, you are entitled to have your own opinions, but, to be critical while being anonymous at the same time, and attacking, and having fun of the exact same person who was helping you out on other boards is underhanded. You may think that you did not do anything wrong and that you are an independent thinker, fuck head, we all are independent thinkers. You think that KJ and I agree on everything no way that is the case. However, when we have something to say to anyone we just say it under our regular handle. The lone exception was when Kj had something to say " to help warn others " and his free speech was taken away. All of this is just a code of respect that was earned over a period of time. I hope you learn something out of this.

 

[bjo32]

bjo32, on one hand, "while using other handles" you compliment a smart poster on other boards while saying that you learned something new. Then you appear at this board with a new handle and enter a reply in post #91 with the following:

"
Excellent post Rattle1! I wasn’t going to weigh in on this topic since it’s such a ridicules claim (for all the reasons you’ve already mentioned) that I can’t believe any intelligent person believes it.

“Beast Mode” is one of the more amusing things APs have come up with. The funny thing is there are some APs that actually think they have exploited it. I don’t know who are dumber, the APs that believe in “beast mode” or the ones who think they have exploited it. Lol."

Of course, you are entitled to have your own opinions, but, to be critical while being anonymous at the same time, and attacking, and having fun of the exact same person who was helping you out on other boards is underhanded. You may think that you did not do anything wrong and that you are an independent thinker, fuck head, we all are independent thinkers. You think that KJ and I agree on everything no way that is the case. However, when we have something to say to anyone we just say it under our regular handle. The lone exception was when Kj had something to say " to help warn others " and his free speech was taken away. All of this is just a code of respect that was earned over a period of time. I hope you learn something out of this.

Bosox, show me where I’ve used different handles to support different sides. You can’t do it because it hasn’t happened. You even said on BJTF, all my handles are very “consistent”. Thank you for that compliment!

I’ve been very consistent on my beliefs on mindplay and beastmode. You should know where I stand on those topics. I only judge people on the topic at hand. There are things where kJ and I agree, and there are things where we don’t agree. It’s that simple. Why is that so hard for you to understand? When I agree with him, I let him know and say something positive. When I don’t agree with him, I do the reverse.

I’m having a hard time understand the point you're trying to make. In fact, even though you use the same handle, you are not very consistent. I’d rather you be like me, using different handles on different sites, but being consistent than what you do, using the same handle but being very inconsistent. I never know what you think because you keep changing your position.

Maybe you can learn something from me. I don’t see anything I can learn from you, except being inconsistent.

 

[BoSox]

bjo32, almost no one knew at that time who you were and that is how you wanted it because deep down you like to start trouble and cause confusion. You are in my book a no good piece of shit.

 

[21forme]

Bosox - he thrives on attention. Best thing you can do is ignore him.

 

[KewlJ]

Bosox - he thrives on attention. Best thing you can do is ignore him.

I think some of this is my fault. I wasn't at BJTF when this A-hole was posting/trolling there under whatever handle he was using there. So when he showed up at a forum where Bosox and I are now at (under a new handle, a third different handle than he uses here), I didn't recognize that it was the same troll. I fell for his "set up" and engaged and started answering his blackjack questions, just as I did here. I am usually pretty good at identifying these trolls, but because I wasn't involved in the initial volley at BJTF, I just didn't recognize it until Bosox brought it to my attention.

It is almost frightening the number of deranged anti-AP, AP hating people that are on some of these forums. In this case this clown is very pro-casino industry, anti-AP. He takes that position on every discussion. He is either casino personnel, perhaps a dealer or pit, or has a family member of that is or something. Some sort of association with the casino industry, which leads him to be anti-AP and troll the AP sites.

 

[BJgenius007]

I didn't think I crossed the line but maybe Norm felt he needed to include me to be thorough. I don't mind taking the hit if that is the case. I won't be pleading my case to Norm. I am sure he had his reasons and it is his site. Too many babies out there wining about how they got banned when everyone could see it coming. I know I toed the line a few times and Norm was patient with me. Getting a suspension that I didn't deserve sort of evens things out. I just don't know why Zee wasn't included. He was constantly attacking people as well. Maybe Zee is the snitch and nobody snitched on Zee. Everyone sees the world as a reflection of themselves. Right before this happened, Zee started throwing the word snitch at everyone. That just can't be a coincidence.

For people who often asked why Three stops posting.

This is the farewell post from T3 (also known as Three or Dummy). He got suspension by Norm when he doesn't deserve it. So he no longer wants to earn eyeballs for Norm.

 

[gronbog]

T3 is not permanently banned at BJTF. That post was about a temporary suspension. He is not posting anywhere these days, although I know that he is still an active player.

 

[psyduck]

There is a good chance that TThree/Dummy stopped posting because finally reality caught up to him. He must have experienced bad negative swings with his "super duper" count.